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General Election - 8th June.

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61 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 16:56

okocha

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
Wander and co: you are in perfect harmony with my own way of thinking. Kindred spirits on this issue.    Smile

62 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 17:01

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I'm still gobsmacked at some of the things they actually promised. Bringing back fox hunting FFS? Scrapping the Human Rights Act?

The Human Rights Act is a UK law passed in 1998. It means that you can defend your rights in the UK courts and that public organisations (including the Government, the Police and local councils) must treat everyone equally, with fairness, dignity and respect.


What possible motive have they got for scrapping that?


Perhaps their piss poor performance is a good thing in this case?

63 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 17:12

Natasha Whittam

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
okocha wrote:Wander and co: you are in perfect harmony with my own way of thinking. Kindred spirits on this issue.    Smile

You should seek therapy.

64 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 17:16

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
2015 Conservative manifesto:
Despite a smattering of new spending pledges on everything from childcare to housebuilding, tackling the deficit still dominates the section of the Conservatives’ manifesto headed “A strong economy to help you and your family”


The document repeats George Osborne’s budget pledge for £30bn of spending cuts over the next two years, and warns that “failing to control our debt would be more than an economic failing; it would be a moral failing”.

Roll forward a year and the new Tory Chancellor Hammond, having failed to meet any of George Osborne's fiscal targets announces that public borrowing will have to be an astonishing £122 BILLION more than the Tories had estimated.
So to use the Chancellor's own words, was that economic failing, moral failing or both Phillip?

Or was it still Labour's fault?
Or is the fact that you couldn't manage your way out of a wet paper bag not the point because Government is all about breaksit?

65 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 17:43

boltonbonce

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I phoned the surgery for an appointment this morning.
Two weeks. Christ,I'll be better by then.
Receptionist grilled me as to why I wanted to see the doctor,and I politely explained that it was none of her sodding business.
I've decided to take the road to herbal healing.

66 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 19:16

okocha

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
Natasha Whittam wrote:
okocha wrote:Wander and co: you are in perfect harmony with my own way of thinking. Kindred spirits on this issue.    Smile

You should seek therapy.
Ironically, my job provides therapy. You are welcome to an appointment.

 No special rate for Wanderers fans. Chorley fans are double, however.

67 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 21:21

xmiles

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Ivan Campo
Ivan Campo
okocha wrote:
Natasha Whittam wrote:
okocha wrote:Wander and co: you are in perfect harmony with my own way of thinking. Kindred spirits on this issue.    Smile

You should seek therapy.
Ironically, my job provides therapy. You are welcome to an appointment.

 No special rate for Wanderers fans. Chorley fans are double, however.

Laughing

68 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Thu Apr 20 2017, 21:25

Natasha Whittam

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
okocha wrote:Ironically, my job provides therapy. You are welcome to an appointment.

Canal Street I presume?

69 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 11:03

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Biggest fall in retail sales in 7 years.
...for all types of goods apart from clothing, shoes and textiles. 

Just goes to show that rising prices are starting to affect everyone apart from my missus although TBF she hasn't bought any textiles this week.

We're well on our way to the predicted 2.4% shrinkage of our economy although this wasn't anticipated to be reached until we have actually left the EU (based on the Government managing to secure trade deals of equal value to the ones we currently have)

The Office of National Statistics state that average store prices have increased 3.3% on the year - the largest rise since 2012 - and that petrol prices have risen 16.4% this year - which reflects the devaluation of sterling.

Twirls remain unaffected although it is expected they'll be a twentieth of their current size by October.

70 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 11:24

Bwfc1958

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Tinned Toms - You know it makes sense!
Theresa May well received in Bolton.... 

71 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 13:33

finlaymcdanger


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
I barely know where to start now that I can vote here again. I'm going to start with Labour unless I can be convinced that there is a better alternative in the coming weeks. Unlikely I'm guessing.

72 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 13:46

Norpig

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Jussi Jääskeläinen
Jussi Jääskeläinen
It seems that the average working class man on the street has given up on Labour, the main issue being that they allowed unchecked immigration in the Blair/Brown eras and are now seen as being left wing champgane socialists who don't care about the working classes anymore.

I'm fed up of this election already as my facebook feed has gone into overdrive now with people i once thought were fairly sensible, spouting the things mentioned above and wanting that idiot Farage to be MP and generally being very right wing

73 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 14:04

Bread2.0

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Andy Walker
Andy Walker
This almost slipped under the radar when it first came out but now that there's an election imminent, it needs re-posting:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-donald-trump-nhs-us-trade-deal-brexit-torture-a7548156.html

Do...not...vote...Tory.....ever.

74 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 14:08

Natasha Whittam

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Bread2.0 wrote:Do...not...vote...Tory.....ever.

I think you might be disappointed come the 8th June.

75 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 14:09

Bread2.0

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Andy Walker
Andy Walker
More than likely, but that said, why should June 8th be any different to any other day in my life?

76 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 14:13

Sluffy

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Admin
Labour is unelectable under Corbyn.

It's as simple as that really.

Even most of the Labour MP's know that and that is why they've tried their best to get rid of him since he was appointed.  

Nearly all of his first shadow cabinet has since quit it - and Andy Burnham who was second to Corbyn when selected, is now even quitting as an MP.

Labour will lose votes in this election - but maybe not that many actual seats as many are electorally 'safe'.

I would imagine UKIP votes will fall and Lib Dem will rise - with the Conservatives making the most gains because of this.

Smart move by May to call an election if for no other reason that everything has changed since the last general election just two years ago - with both the principle architects of the manifesto - Cameron and Osborne not standing this time.

It will strengthen her right to govern and to take on Brexit in the way she wants to do it.

I think ultimately that that is a good thing.

Somebody needs to take charge at times like this.

As you simply can't please everyone all the time.

Shame Cameron led us into this needless mess anyway, just to deal with some in-house political point scoring within his party.

77 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 14:35

Cajunboy

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
The various opposition parties like to say that May has no mandate to govern.

Well come the 8th June she will have a mandate and hopefully a majority of 50 - 100 seats.

She can then get on with negotiating our exit from the EU , without the spoiling tactics of the people who don't seem to understand that the electorate voted for Brexit.

78 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 16:06

Norpig

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Jussi Jääskeläinen
Jussi Jääskeläinen
Bread2.0 wrote:This almost slipped under the radar when it first came out but now that there's an election imminent, it needs re-posting:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-donald-trump-nhs-us-trade-deal-brexit-torture-a7548156.html

Do...not...vote...Tory.....ever.
The Tories won't rest until they have privatised the NHS, the bastards

79 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 16:48

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Cajunboy wrote:The various opposition parties like to say that May has no mandate to govern.

Well come the 8th June she will have a mandate and hopefully a majority of 50 - 100 seats.

She can then get on with negotiating our exit from the EU , without the spoiling tactics of the people who don't seem to understand that the electorate voted for Brexit.
I think everybody has got the hang of the fact that we are leaving the EU by now so if anyone needs to move on it's the Tories who keep conveniently harking back to it instead of talking about what's actually happening in the country. 
Surely this election is about what Britain wants to be, but the Tories are trying to make it about Brexit and not the real issues they are failing us on so at best it's a decoy.
Being out of the EU is a symptom, not a solution and we need to have a serious dialogue about jobs, health, education, services and what we're aiming for.

80 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Fri Apr 21 2017, 18:48

Cajunboy

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
wanderlust wrote:
Cajunboy wrote:The various opposition parties like to say that May has no mandate to govern.

Well come the 8th June she will have a mandate and hopefully a majority of 50 - 100 seats.

She can then get on with negotiating our exit from the EU , without the spoiling tactics of the people who don't seem to understand that the electorate voted for Brexit.
I think everybody has got the hang of the fact that we are leaving the EU by now so if anyone needs to move on it's the Tories who keep conveniently harking back to it instead of talking about what's actually happening in the country. 
Surely this election is about what Britain wants to be, but the Tories are trying to make it about Brexit and not the real issues they are failing us on so at best it's a decoy.
Being out of the EU is a symptom, not a solution and we need to have a serious dialogue about jobs, health, education, services and what we're aiming for.
I totally agree with you.

 The so called bed -blocking caused by the lack of investment in social care is continually  swept under the carpet.  All the problems of people living longer, but with  more health problems is a massive subject,   that should be confronted  by and across all parties and should not be a political football.  Sadly it will remain a political football.

81 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 10:32

okocha

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
Well worth reading:

A London School of Economics study into how Jeremy Corbyn is represented in the media found that only a paltry 11% of all newspaper articles about him bothered to accurately state a single one of his actual policies. In the hard-wing Daily Mail and Express that figure was 0%.

Given this lack of unbiased political coverage it's not difficult to understand why so many people are so unfamiliar with Jeremy Corbyn's actual policies, and tend to judge him as if politics is some kind of vapid personality contest.

So here are some of the Jeremy Corbyn policies that the mainstream media really don't want to tell you about, so you can judge for yourself whether you like them or not.
Labour Party policies


Ban companies based in tax havens bidding for government contracts
It's astounding that this isn't the case already. How on earth could anyone even attempt to justify taxpayers' cash being paid to companies based in tax havens for the purpose of dodging tax?

£10 minimum wage for all workers over the age of 18
The UK is the only country in the developed world where workers' wages are declining in real terms, while the economy is actually growing. A £10 minimum wage would help to reverse this scenario, and it would also significantly reduce the cost of in-work benefits like tax credits and housing benefit (most of which goes to working families these days).

All rented accommodation to be fit for human habitation
Again, astounding that this isn't the case already, but in January 2016 the Tories (over 1/3 of whom are landlords) deliberately voted down a Labour Party amendment to their housing bill to ensure that all rented accommodation is fit for human habitation.

Renationalise the railways
This is a very popular policy that is supported by an overwhelming majority of the public. Do you support rail renationalisation too, or are you one of the minority who think that the current shambles is acceptable?

Renationalise the NHS
The Tory party have been carving up the English NHS and distributing the pieces to the private sector, Jeremy Corbyn has pledged to reverse this process. Are you one of the 84% of people who thinks the NHS should be run as a not for profit public service, or the 7% who agree with the ongoing Tory privatisation agenda?

Free school meals
The policy of providing free school meals to all school children between the ages of 4 and 11 is based on evidence based research showing that universal free school meals lead to significantly improved grades. It will be paid for by ending the generous tax breaks (public subsidies) for the 7% of kids who go to private fee-paying schools.

Create a National Education Service
Jeremy Corbyn believes that education is a right, not a commodity. He wants to create an integrated National Education Service to ensure that education is freely available to anyone who needs it. 

Scrap tuition fees
Thanks to the Tories (and their Lib-Dem enablers) UK students now face the most expensive tuition fees in the industrialised world for study at public universities, meaning students typically leave university with £50,000 of debt, and two thirds of them will never pay off their student debts. Labour would end this lunacy by getting rid of student fees.

Restore NHS Bursaries
One of the first things Theresa My did when she came to power was to scrap NHS bursaries for nurses and other NHS workers. This removal of financial support for nurses has caused a huge 10,000 decline in the number of applicants to nursing courses. This collapse in nursing recruitment would be bad enough in its own right, but in combination with a record increase in the number of EU nurses quitting the NHS and a mind-boggling 92% fall in nursing recruitment from EU countries, the UK is clearly facing a massive NHS recruitment crisis. Labour would reverse this calamitous state of affairs by restoring NHS Bursaries for trainee nurses.


Increase the carers allowance
Labour are proposing to increase the Carers Allowance for the 1 million unpaid carers in the UK. This would be paid for by scrapping the Tories' Inheritance Tax cut for millionaires. Unpaid carers save the UK economy an estimated £132 million a year, and they're doing ever more work as a result of the £4.6 billion in Tory cuts to the social care budget.

Create a National Investment Bank
This is actually one of Jeremy Corbyn's best policies, but few people actually understand it. It's absolutely clear that allowing private banks to determine where money is invested ends up in huge speculative bubbles in housing and financial derivatives, while the real economy is starved of cash. A National Investment Bank would work by investing in things like infrastructure, services, businesses and regional development projects, and would end up becoming a kind of sovereign wealth fund for the UK.

End the public sector pay freeze
Under Tory rule UK workers suffered the longest sustained decline in real wages since records began. The public sector pay freeze contributed massively to this. You'd have to be economically illiterate to imagine that repressing public sector wages with below inflation pay rises for year after year would not exert downwards pressure on private sector wages too. Ending the public sector pay freeze would actually boost the economy by putting more money in people's pockets, meaning an increase in aggregate demand.


End sweetheart tax deals between HMRC and massive corporations

David Cameron (the son of a tax-dodger) repeatedly lied through his teeth about how serious he was about confronting tax-dodging, whilst allowing HMRC to concoct sweetheart deals with corporations like Google, Vodafone and Starbucks. One of the main reasons the corporate press are so strongly opposed to Jeremy Corbyn is that they know that unlike David Cameron, he's serious when he talks about clamping down on tax-dodging.

Stop major corporations ripping off their suppliers
Major corporations are withholding an astounding £26 billion through late payment, which is responsible for an estimated 50,000 small businesses going bust every year. The scale of this problem is so massive that it should be a national scandal, and Jeremy Corbyn is absolutely right to align himself with small businesses to defend their interests. 

Reverse the Tory corporation tax cuts
Since 2010 the Tories have cut the rate of corporation tax for major multinational corporations from 28% to just 17% (by 2020) meaning the UK has one of the lowest corporation tax rates in the developed world. The global average is 27% and the G7 average is 32.3%. Theresa May has already threatened to lower the corporation tax even further to turn post-brexit Britiain into a tax haven economy, Corbyn is proposing to do the opposite and increase corporation tax rates so they're more in line with the rest of the developed world.

Defend Human Rights
Theresa May has repeatedly expressed her intention to tear up Winston Churchill's finest legacy, the European Convention on Human Rights. Labour would oppose this Tory attack on our human rights.

Zero Hours Contracts ban
Almost a million UK workers are now on exploitative Zero Hours Contracts. Last year the New Zealand parliament voted to ban them, and Labour is proposing to do the same. Long-term employees and workers doing regular hours would be protected from Zero Hours Contract exploitation.

Holding the Tories to account over Brexit

Labour have said that they won't block Brexit, but they will seek to hold the Tories to account over it. A landslide Tory victory would be a disaster for the UK because it would allow Theresa May to pursue the most right-wing pro-corporate anti-worker Brexit possible with almost no democratic scrutiny. The only way to make sure the Tories don't push a fanatically right-wing Brexit on the nation is to ensure that there are plenty of opposition MPs to hold them to account.

Housebuilding
Under the Tory government the level of UK housebuilding has slumped to the lowest levels since the 1920s, even though demand for housing is extremely high. Labour are guaranteeing to invest in a programme of housebuilding, and committing to ensure that half of the new houses are social housing. This wouldn't just alleviate the housing crisis, it would also stimulate the economy by increasing aggregate demand.

Combat inequality
George Osborne's ideological austerity agenda resulted in the longest sustained decline in workers' wages since records began and condemned an additional 400,000 children to growing up in poverty, meanwhile the tiny super-rich majority literally doubled their wealth. Labour is pledging to reduce the inequality gap and introduce progressive policies to reduce the gap between the incomes of the highest and lowest paid. There is plenty of evidence to show that the least unequal societies are more economically successful places where the people are happier.

82 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 11:16

Natasha Whittam

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
It's very easy to pretend how you're going to change the country when you're not in power.

The problem comes when you do get in power and realise you can't do half of what you wanted to do.

Labour were in charge not too long ago, I don't remember them changing things for the better - although they did manage to take us to war and ruin the economy.

83 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 13:15

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Natasha Whittam wrote:It's very easy to pretend how you're going to change the country when you're not in power.

The problem comes when you do get in power and realise you can't do half of what you wanted to do.
And that's exactly what's happening to the Tories here and Trump in the US.

Massive backpedalling on his promises by Trump (already) but here it's worse where attention is being diverted away from the Tories failure to deliver anything at all by the Brexit sideshow - which is incidentally going tits up as the world watches on and laughs at us.

84 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 13:42

wanderlust

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Look at that over there. It's Brexit. We're not really going to raise taxes to pay for our disastrous management of the economy. No seriously, look at Brexit. Nothing to see here. Move on folks. Haven't you got homes to go to? No? So what if we forgot to build them? Look - it's Brexit!

85 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 14:20

okocha

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Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
It's time to genuinely consider policies rather than personalities for once; time to look at morality within parties' manifestos and within newspapers; time for politicians to be honest rather than slyly manipulative or downright self-interested cheats. (Ha....fat chance!)

The trouble is that the public only finds out about the lies, empty promises and unethical practices after the event.

What if we could all abstain? Shocked  Very Happy (I know...fat chance again.) But at least that would shock politicians into a realisation of how fed up the public is. This disaffection with politics seems to be sweeping the globe....but still the establishment turns a blind eye. At the moment I don't feel there is any one party worth voting for. (Sorry, Manda...)

Who's going to begin the "Vote Abstain" Party?!

86 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 14:25

Bread2.0

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Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Sorry, I'm out.

I'm not giving up drinking for anybody.

87 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 14:30

boltonbonce

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
We need our very own Bernie Sanders.

Not seeing much from Labour. Did anyone hear the shambles of an interview Dawn Butler gave on Radio 4

88 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sat Apr 22 2017, 15:41

karlypants

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Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
boltonbonce wrote:We need our very own Bernie Sanders.
Any relation to Colonel Sanders?

89 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sun Apr 23 2017, 19:37

Bread2.0

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Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Meanwhile, on the other side of La Manche.....

...it looks like it'll be a straight shoot out in the final between Macron and Le Pen.

And as a Bolton fan, I'll obviously be crossing my fingers for a Macron win.

Not least because he's not a fascist wanker.

90 Re: General Election - 8th June. on Sun Apr 23 2017, 19:59

Soul Kitchen

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Ivan Campo
Ivan Campo
boltonbonce wrote:I phoned the surgery for an appointment this morning.
Two weeks. Christ,I'll be better by then.
Receptionist grilled me as to why I wanted to see the doctor,and I politely explained that it was none of her sodding business.
I've decided to take the road to herbal healing.
You should have told her you had a slack inch and taken it from there!

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