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My pro-Dougie stance...

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luckyPeterpiper
Boggersbelief
Keegan
terenceanne
Hipster_Nebula
White84
Lifeofriley
Angry Dad
doffcocker
Norpig
Natasha Whittam
Bolton Nuts
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31My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Fri Jan 03 2014, 23:03

Guest


Guest

terenceanne wrote:.but the real talent is spotting talent, using and motivating that talent in the best way possible way. Auld Doogie doesn't seem to have it. OC was better but not by much.  

You're going to need to justify this for me.

For what it's worth I agree with Biggie in terms of giving Dougie more time. I think a lot of posters on here have gone way over the top in their criticism of him, I want to give him the next year or so and see if he brings through the talent that he's recruited. 

It's the most long term plan we've had in my time supporting the club and if we have any hopes of surviving in future we need it to come off. Understandably; given recent results, some want to get rid but I'm willing to back him so long as the players are on side (which I think they are) and he continues to bring in decent youngsters, the proof will be if he brings them through and builds his own side.

The board can't afford to get rid of him anyway, this was clearly Gartside's last gamble and I still think it will come off.

32My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Fri Jan 03 2014, 23:31

Guest


Guest

We are in 18th place in the second tier of English football and going nowhere fast.

"It's the most long-term plan we've had in my time supporting the club...(etc)."

Great.

But ask yourself, just how desperate does that actually sound....?

33My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Fri Jan 03 2014, 23:57

Guest


Guest

Even before we got relegated it was obvious the club needed a complete restructure. Similar to sides like Aston Villa in the premier league now, we need to get rid of all the high earning dross who bring nothing to the first team and start getting the most from the academy.

The mannyroad article detailing how much we've wasted on players is embarrassing and goes to show how poorly run the club has been since Allardyce left. My support of Dougie is based on him approaching the rebuild in the right way, that means bringing youth through and buying smart - i.e. getting high earners off the wage bill and bringing in players who will do a job for us. Case in point, getting Andrews and Sordell off the wage bill to bring in Moritz a good and ruthless decision which the squad has benefited from, moving on SKD and hopefully come the end of the season getting shot of the remaining high earners.

Tactically he can improve, although he's nowhere near as bad as many make out. 4231 is not a defensive formation in any way, what he needs to do is be less cautious in his containment of the opposition. But given a stronger defence I think that will come in time. He hasn't been able to get rid of Mills, Knight or Wheater so far and all are earning very good money so let's see who he replaces one or two of them with come summer.

So it may sound desperate to you at the moment, but it's my opinion and he's shown enough positives to convince me he's worth giving more time to.

34My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 00:12

Guest


Guest

He's fucking clueless tactically.

It's ten men behind the ball and hope to hit 'em on the break. That's why we see him shoving Zat Knight up front for the last ten minutes after we've gone behind.

And with our defence that's never going to work, it's a stupid strategy anyway.

It's like watching a Megson team in the Prem but a division down......

Get rid now before he properly fucks it up and we go down another division.

35My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 07:57

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

bwfc1874 wrote:Even before we got relegated it was obvious the club needed a complete restructure. Similar to sides like Aston Villa in the premier league now, we need to get rid of all the high earning dross who bring nothing to the first team and start getting the most from the academy.


You talk as though Dougie is going to get rid of the likes of Knight, Ngog, Mills etc and replace them with cheap world beaters.

Firstly, this so called "dross" is still being picked by Dougie week after week, so I'm not convinced he sees them as dross. And of the players Dougie has signed so far, how many have been better than the "dross" already at the club? None I would say.

Give this clown another year and we will be in a far worse position than we are now, as difficult as that sounds.

36My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 07:59

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

bwfc1874 wrote:

For what it's worth I agree with Biggie in terms of giving Dougie more time. I think a lot of posters on here have gone way over the top in their criticism of him, I want to give him the next year or so and see if he brings through the talent that he's recruited. 


Easy to give a manager another year from the comfort of your armchair. Try shelling out £30 a game for the next year in the very unlikely chance Dougie will turn things around.

I'm guessing your patience would soon wane.

37My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 08:14

Guest


Guest

Natasha Whittam wrote:
bwfc1874 wrote:Even before we got relegated it was obvious the club needed a complete restructure. Similar to sides like Aston Villa in the premier league now, we need to get rid of all the high earning dross who bring nothing to the first team and start getting the most from the academy.


You talk as though Dougie is going to get rid of the likes of Knight, Ngog, Mills etc and replace them with cheap world beaters.

Firstly, this so called "dross" is still being picked by Dougie week after week, so I'm not convinced he sees them as dross. And of the players Dougie has signed so far, how many have been better than the "dross" already at the club? None I would say.

Give this clown another year and we will be in a far worse position than we are now, as difficult as that sounds.

So far I'd say Dougie's record for players in and out has been good, better than the previous two managers anyway. So I'd be happy to see what he can do if he gets Wheater, Knight, Mills, N'gog, Mears etc out. So far the problem has been more how he's used the players.

38My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 10:08

Soul Kitchen

Soul Kitchen
Ivan Campo
Ivan Campo

Breadman wrote:We are in 18th place in the second tier of English football and going nowhere fast.

"It's the most long-term plan we've had in my time supporting the club...(etc)."

Great.

But ask yourself, just how desperate does that actually sound....?

Has anybody actually got any knowledge of what this plan is outside the club? I'd love to know what it is and I could go easier on my wrists if there was any sense in it?

39My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 12:33

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Biggie wrote:
Hipster_Nebula wrote:I can't find it i think he's taken it down.

It got a copyright warning and was then taken down.

Shame, I'm not taking the piss i agreed with everything in that video.

40My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 12:36

Soul Kitchen

Soul Kitchen
Ivan Campo
Ivan Campo

Can you clarify with a rough outline Hipster of the contents?

41My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 14:26

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Interesting thread. I support Dougie for now, but for a completely different set of reasons and IMO his strengths and weaknesses tend to be the opposite sides of the same coin e.g.
* Understand what he's trying to do tactically but he hasn't got the players to do it - so should he change tactics to suit or keep hoping the players will improve enough to carry it off? I give him the benefit of the doubt for now because he's still in the process of revamping the squad.
* To revamp the squad with players who can do what he wants/needs (i.e quick, strong, skilful - as he has previously alluded to) he has no money but he seems to be doing all he can in the circumstances. Sure he bought a couple of low-cost stopgaps and loaned a few to tide us over, but I don't think that's what he's aiming for long term. I can see why he bought Beckford for instance even though he has two left feet.
* On the one hand, he's the first manager since Todd who has had the nads to refuse to pay over the odds and is prepared to walk away from a deal even if the fans are baying for a signing. On the other hand some of the stopgap signings have been unimpressive (still better than what he inherited, but not the finished article) Prepared to wait until the end of the summer transfer window to see what he does as he'll be offloading a few then if he can't offload them in January.
* Like every armchair manager, I often disagree with his selections and system but it is what it is and for the most part I can understand his thinking, even if I disagree. For the reasons above I'm OK with this for now on the basis that as he changes the squad, younger players come into contention and the injury list shortens those players will understand what Dougie expects of them and should be confident playing Dougie's way. Then we'll know what he's about.

I have a lot of reservations about Dougie's abilities but he seems to be doing some good stuff that in theory should bear fruit down the line and I'm worried about throwing the baby out with the bath water if we were to change yet again.

42My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sat Jan 04 2014, 23:49

Reebok Trotter

Reebok Trotter
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Got his tactics right today. We should go with the same format in the league.

43My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sun Jan 05 2014, 01:09

Bolton Nuts


Admin

Told you its due to come good. I know we changed to a more attacking style - what's your point?

Hipster. Your post about the Kevin Davies video sounds like a piss take, is it? And what was in it? I can't really remember... And I can't find it.

https://boltonnuts.forumotion.co.uk

44My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sun Jan 05 2014, 09:03

Soul Kitchen

Soul Kitchen
Ivan Campo
Ivan Campo

One swallow, it's summer!!

45My pro-Dougie stance... - Page 3 Empty Re: My pro-Dougie stance... Sun Jan 05 2014, 12:43

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Breadman wrote:We are in 18th place in the second tier of English football and going nowhere fast.

"It's the most long-term plan we've had in my time supporting the club...(etc)."

Great.

But ask yourself, just how desperate does that actually sound....?

It sounds helluva desperate. Unfortunately it's a very accurate summary of where we are at - in desperate need to rebuild a team with f*** all budget.

The sooner the players wake up and realise that they are not premiership players, that we are in deep shit and that the only reason they are still playing for us is because we haven't got the resources to replace them immediately, the better.

Who the f*** do they (and some fans) think they are?
The table would suggest they are LOSERS and if they think otherwise they should prove it.

And seeing as we haven't the resources to change things quickly, a long-term plan seems eminently sensible - or rather our only hope in these difficult times.

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