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Lest we forget - 100 years since WW1 ended.

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1Lest we forget - 100 years since WW1 ended. Empty Lest we forget - 100 years since WW1 ended. on Sun Nov 11, 2018 9:00 pm

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Sorry I've not been around much lately otherwise I most certainly have started this thread much sooner.

The war to end all wars ended 100 years ago today after a pointless four years of men killing each other for nothing much really, other than their country's politicians saying they must do.

Something like 15 million people lost their lives and for what - as another World War broke out just 21 years later!

Although I've not seen his speech I believe Macron, the French President talked about how we should reject nationalism - and he's right - WW1 was all about Germany wanting to be top dog of the world instead of Great Britton as we were back then - and 100 years later we still have the likes of us wanting to stand alone with Brexit rather than stay with 27 other country's, Trump/America banging on about 'make America great again' and starting trade wars with country's around the world and Putin/Russia medalling in and destabilising other country's to further their own agenda.

You could even go much further than that and throw in places like Saudi Arabia and Iran stirring things up in the middle east (Turkey as well) although that is more about religious 'nationalism' rather than country's boarders.

We all knows it goes on - out 'tribe'/country is better than yours - but someone, somewhere has to make a start to say, we have moved on from that, we know better now, we tried that a 100 years ago and it didn't work then and it certainly won't work now.

Anyway let us remember and respect all the fallen of all the wars on the centenary of the ending of WW1.


In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
   That mark our place; and in the sky
   The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
   Loved and were loved, and now we lie,
       In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
   The torch; be yours to hold it high.
   If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
       In Flanders fields.

By John McCrae

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

gloswhite

gloswhite
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
Welcome back Sluffy, and straight into comments that I personally, think are a bit silly.
and 100 years later we still have the likes of us wanting to stand alone with Brexit rather than stay with 27 other country's, 
To be honest, this is crap. We aren't going to war with anyone, threatening anyone, and in fact are looking to make our own decisions, rather that being dragged into situations that we have no control over.
As i said, welcome back  Smile

rammywhite

rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
Brilliant film by Peter Jackson. Its on iPlayer for a week- seriously, if you missed it last night go and watch it and see what the young men and women at the front had to go through.
it was followed by Vera Brittain's Testament to Youth- another outstanding film. And, as Sluffy says, smug self satisfied political leaders are showing the same symptoms as political leaders did then.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@gloswhite wrote:Welcome back Sluffy, and straight into comments that I personally, think are a bit silly.
and 100 years later we still have the likes of us wanting to stand alone with Brexit rather than stay with 27 other country's, 
To be honest, this is crap. We aren't going to war with anyone, threatening anyone, and in fact are looking to make our own decisions, rather that being dragged into situations that we have no control over.
As i said, welcome back  Smile

Thank you for the welcome of my return.

I never implied that we were going to war with anyone (nor any of the other country's I mentioned too) but my point (and Macron's also) was 'united we stand, divided we fall'.

If you know your history and I'm sure you do, all nations grew from a collection of 'tribes' joining and merging with others to expand and grow their wealth and resources and become stronger and have a better live.

England's inhabitants the Celtic Britons merged with immigrants from Germany - the Angle and Saxon tribes - Scotland was populated by immigrants from Ireland, the Scot's - from which the country gets its name.

 The Celts, who apparently are the 'tribe' that that are about the basis of who were here before the Angle, Saxons, Picts, Scots, etc turned up - and who I guess could be called native Britons originally migrated from central Europe, from about Switzerland the experts reckon.

These people over the years merged with and grew with each other and in England for example formed 'counties' such as Wessex, Mercia, East Anglia, Northumbria, etc, and as the years went by (and with the conquest and influence of the Romans (who by the way did not all come from Italy - many came from the country's the Romans had already conquered) England as we know it took shape by the merging of these counties under one central leader and control - and thus making the country stronger and safer from attack and bigger and better to create wealth and trade.

Chuck in in influx of Vikings (Scandinavians) and the Irish merging with us since then and hopefully you begin to see we are not true English at all - our DNA is already mixed European.

Yet as a set of mongrels we went on to rule the world with our empire before our nationalism which served us so well up to then crashed head first into Germany's (Austo-Hungary's) nationalism, to protect France's nationalism - hence WWI.

If history has taught us anything it is that merging and developing people and cultures is far more beneficial than defending boarders and barriers from all others.

Macron was right.

I've no doubts whatsoever that at sometime in the future, maybe not in my lifetime, that Britton will once again join with the rest of Europe in partnership as it is the way that history flows and always has done.

We are no longer an island and should stop thinking like one.

gloswhite

gloswhite
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
Sluffy, do you not see the contradiction in what you are saying?  I agree with small tribes, neighbors, etc, joining together, but at some point they become the biggest fish in the pond, and decide that they no longer need to listen to others, or stay together for protection, but can use their size and weight for expansionism, which leads to wars. There are a lot of small countries about the world, and they don't seem to be overly worried about being invaded.
Yes, we are an island, and for centuries we have done very well in the world, and I don't understand why people feel that we cannot survive a change in the way in which we trade with other countries.
Thanks for the history lesson, however, I really would prefer it if you spelled Britain correctly  Very Happy

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Perversely, I think the vast majority of people have never felt more pro-European than the last 12 months or so. Trumps behaviour alongside that of Merkel/Macron really shines a light on his complete lack of class and integrity. I know who I’d rather be aligned with.

gloswhite

gloswhite
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
To be honest TROY, i really think they are all extremely devious, and in their own way, are looking out for their own country first, regardless of all this talk about the EU experiment and cooperation, (I feel that France and Germany collude to get what they can out of the EU). The difference between all three being that Trump hasn't got the intelligence, or finesse, to behave as the other two do.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Take your point that they’re looking after number one - as they are elected to. Don’t see anything particularly devious about Macron or Merkel though to be honest.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Trump also sees nationalism as a ‘really great’ thing. Whereas Macron/merkel are clearly more aware of the danger it poses - particularly when whipped up into a frenzy.

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
I see Corbyn turned up at the Cenotaph in a hooded anorak.

No doubt chosen to appeal to his core voters.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Cajunboy wrote:I see Corbyn turned up at the Cenotaph in a hooded anorak.

No doubt chosen to appeal to his core voters.

It was raining most of the weekend, what’s the issue?

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Can you buy an anorak without a hood?

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@T.R.O.Y wrote:
@Cajunboy wrote:I see Corbyn turned up at the Cenotaph in a hooded anorak.

No doubt chosen to appeal to his core voters.

It was raining most of the weekend, what’s the issue?
The issue is Respect.

rammywhite

rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
Better than Michael Foot in his donkey jacket though

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Cajunboy wrote:
@T.R.O.Y wrote:
@Cajunboy wrote:I see Corbyn turned up at the Cenotaph in a hooded anorak.

No doubt chosen to appeal to his core voters.

It was raining most of the weekend, what’s the issue?
The issue is Respect.

You show respect by your actions not by how water repellant your coat is.

How soft are you getting offended about that.

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@rammywhite wrote:Better than Michael Foot in his donkey jacket though
That wasn't a donkey jacket. It was,in fact, an expensive coat. In fact the Queen Mother complimented him on it. Unfortunately, Foot was one of those people who couldn't look smart in a ten grand suit. I'm much the same.
Sadly, the poppy and fashion Nazis usually make their presence known at this time of year, and I'm heartily sick of them.
Woe betide any newscaster/presenter who doesn't appear on screen wearing a poppy. And the anorak?
I saw many brave old soldiers marching by wearing similar. It's a non story.
Unless you're The Mail.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Agreed Bonce, almost as if the mail and people who read it are looking to get offended by anything. 

Snowflakes.

rammywhite

rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
@T.R.O.Y wrote:Agreed Bonce, almost as if the mail and people who read it are looking to get offended by anything. 

Snowflakes.

Never read the Mail in my life.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Directed at Cajun to be honest, hadn’t realised you were agreeing with him.

Would be interested to understand why you think it’s a fair criticism though, are we not free to dress how we choose?

rammywhite

rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
@T.R.O.Y wrote:Directed at Cajun to be honest, hadn’t realised you were agreeing with him.

I'm not. I'm neither agreeing nor disagreeing with anyone. I really don't care what Jeremy Corbyn was wearing. I'm just pleased that he was there.
If I'm going to criticise anyone for the service at the Cenotaph it would be Ian Blackford from the SNP. Some people are simply not born to wear the kilt.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Very fair Ram.

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@T.R.O.Y wrote:
@Cajunboy wrote:
@T.R.O.Y wrote:
@Cajunboy wrote:I see Corbyn turned up at the Cenotaph in a hooded anorak.

No doubt chosen to appeal to his core voters.

It was raining most of the weekend, what’s the issue?
The issue is Respect.

You show respect by your actions not by how water repellant your coat is.

How soft are you getting offended about that.
You've missed the point entirely.

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
I’d like to see you try and explain the point.

gloswhite

gloswhite
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
I'm with Cajun on this. There are certain times, and events, where dress makes a difference, and this is one of them. The wearing of appropriate dress is part of the mark of respect shown. People will be advocating trainers next. 
If you don't like the dress code, don't go, and mark your respect in your own way.

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
This is just another media attempt to discredit Corbyn. He turned up, had a poppy on  and was wearing a tie and laid a wreath, where is the issue in that?

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Norpig wrote:This is just another media attempt to discredit Corbyn. He turned up, had a poppy on  and was wearing a tie and laid a wreath, where is the issue in that?

Correct.

Anorak or not. It wouldn't have bothered me if he was wearing a bright yellow top.

The main thing is that he was there to pay his respects.

I did notice that he bowed his head more than the rest of them and Theresa bloody May looked half arsed!

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@gloswhite wrote:I'm with Cajun on this. There are certain times, and events, where dress makes a difference, and this is one of them. The wearing of appropriate dress is part of the mark of respect shown. People will be advocating trainers next. 
Thanks Glos, I couldn't have put it better.

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Cajunboy wrote:
@gloswhite wrote:I'm with Cajun on this. There are certain times, and events, where dress makes a difference, and this is one of them. The wearing of appropriate dress is part of the mark of respect shown. People will be advocating trainers next. 
Thanks Glos, I couldn't have put it better.

If he'd turned up in his finest suit you would still find something to moan about!

gloswhite

gloswhite
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
I don't think that's true Mr Pig. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't turn up if he didn't have to.

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