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Wigan in Administration

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331Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Fri Sep 25 2020, 00:23

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Another of the young lads brilliant interviews - he put's the likes of Iles to shame.

Not listened to it all yet but I've posted it up for those who like to listen to this sort of stuff.

He's trying to fix up an interview with Nixon soon - that should be a good view if he does!

332Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Fri Sep 25 2020, 01:14

Hip Priest

Hip Priest
Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
This young lad is really on the ball and knows his stuff, whereas Burnham is, sadly as usual, just waffling, out of his depth and all wind and piss. He's looking down on Burnham and asking questions he knows the fawning politician can't answer without betraying the fact that he really knows next to nothing about the club's situation, and couldn't really give a shit about Wigan Athletic except for the kudos and political points scoring available from pretending he's genuinely concerned about the future of the club and it's supporters. 
If more Wigan fans were like this lad instead of the myriad knuckledraggers I seem to encounter who profess to support them I would be a lot more sympathetic to their cause.

333Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Fri Sep 25 2020, 08:23

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Sluffy wrote:Another of the young lads brilliant interviews - he put's the likes of Iles to shame.

Not listened to it all yet but I've posted it up for those who like to listen to this sort of stuff.

He's trying to fix up an interview with Nixon soon - that should be a good view if he does!

Same here, Sluffy. I've not listened to it all but he is quite good at questioning.

He referred to the Bolton administration being three months. That was a long time for all concerned but given the circumstances (double administration) it was understandable.

The real reason for the double administration was never analysed or reported so much as it was used to  justify continuance of the lynch mob mentality fomented by Iles of the Beeno and the ST.

Anderson was left with no choice other than to go for a double admin when Rubens hand was revealed but I expect he was always one step ahead of them.

334Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Sun Sep 27 2020, 23:29

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Bit of 'old' news first - this link going back to early July links Wigan rugby owner Ian Lenagan and Darryl Eales to being early bidders for Wigan (or was it just a bid for the stadium?), which went nowhere as we now know -

https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/sport/18566353.two-ex-oxford-united-owners-eye-bid-wigan-athletic/

The bit of 'new' news though is last week Eales became a Director at Lenagan Investment Ltd - whose address just happens to be the DW Stadium -

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/06302126/filing-history

Coincidence or prelude to something happening with the ownership of the stadium from out of Administration perhaps...?

Time will tell no doubt.

335Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Sun Sep 27 2020, 23:33

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
The young man's done it again - interview with Alan Nixon, no less!

Remind me again what Iles actually get paid for???

Fair play to Nixon as well - he comes across very well I thought.

336Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Sep 29 2020, 16:35

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Seems like the same old stuff being regurgitated but never the less here is the latest -

New Wigan Athletic bidder 'wants deal this week'
Co-administrator Gerald Krasner has revealed a new bidder has today joined the race to buy Wigan Athletic – with the intention of securing a deal this week!

Latics are coming to the end of their third month in administration, which kicked in on July 1 thanks to the actions of the previous owners.
While the French-American group fronted by Oostende CEO Gauthier Ganaye – the long-time frontrunners – last week pulled out, Krasner is optimistic a deal is still within touching distance.
“We had a new one come in this (Monday) morning, who wants to do it this week,” he told the Wigan Post.
“Somebody phoned me with instructions to do the deal. To be fair, he completed his NDA in four minutes flat – which is a record.
“I’ve been dealing with him all morning. He’s now got the contract and everything.
“Whether it happens is another matter."
Krasner says the new bidder has taken the total number in the 'inner ring' to five.
“There’s plenty of rumours going around at the moment," he acknowledged.
"But the reality is we have five (would-be) ‘buyers’.
“I’ve got an inner ring of bidders and an outer ring of bidders.
“At some stage, one of these bids should drop in.
“I am still optimistic, but we need to get that signed contract.”
There had been speculation over the weekend of a Dutch consortium making its move.
Krasner, though, played a straight bat to the rumours.
“A Dutch consortium? That’s news to me,” he said.
“I’m not aware of any Dutch link, but then again when I’m speaking to people I don’t ask where they come from.
"It’s possible there may be a Dutch link, but at the moment I’m not aware of one.”
Krasner also revealed he’s on the verge of doing a deal to offload Sharpey’s – which had been valued at £500,000 in the process.
“I’ve had a good offer on Sharpey’s,” he added. “And I’ve told certain people we’re going to accept it.
“If they don’t like it...either sign the contract or we’re going to sell it.
“You can’t just sit there doing nothing.”

https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/football/new-wigan-athletic-bidder-wants-deal-week-2985856



337Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Sep 30 2020, 09:53

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Tuesday, 29 September 2020
Gerald Krasner Pt 5

The fifth meeting with Gerald Krasner took place this evening, Tuesday 29/09/20. The telephone call lasted 38 minutes.


Rumours The Americans have gone for good, but there are ‘other’ Americans interested.
I don’t know of any Dutch interest, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t one, because we’ve sent out 106 NDAs now and we’ve dealt with 22 bidders so far.

EFL I’ve no complaints with the EFL, they’ve kept to the rules, they’ve let us trade it on, they want Wigan to survive, they’re actually talking today about money distribution. If there is any money coming down it won’t be for us now, but will be for the new owners.
The EFL are in regular contact, I had a phone call with them yesterday, which I’m not going into because it is highly confidential, but they have expressed no concern at this current moment in time. They are in weekly contact.

Running Costs We have a monthly cost of £600K, of which the players wages are £217K, without a buyer, or EFL intervention, as I said previously, we won’t make Christmas.

Alan Nixon Interview I would accept that Mr Nixon gave a very fair and balanced interview from the fans point of view, using a lot of information that was in the public arena or that had been given to him off the record despite NDAs, unfortunately the people giving him this information didn’t give him the full picture on what the bids actually were. With regards to the fees, the club aren’t paying the fees and we still haven’t drawn a penny yet.  
But in fairness it was a good interview and it shows he understands what has gone on, he’s been used by the Americans and he’s used them for stories, that’s what journalists do.

More Bids For Players? We aren’t looking to sell anymore, what you have to bear in mind is some of the sales, and we’ve sold all the valuable ones I accept, is due to the players themselves handing in transfer requests in writing and we can’t refuse it. It’s not that we've sold them, we’ve had a request from the players, they didn’t want to play on lower wages.
There are no bids sitting on the table for any of the players left in the squad, we need to put a team out so there is no one left that we can sell.

Administrations I’ve had a look in previous administrations how long it took to sell the football clubs, Bolton was two and half months, Bournemouth was over a year, Port Vale was roughly a year, Stockport a year, Bolton is the only one to be quicker and we’ve been here just 3 months on Thursday. So despite what people may feel, this isn’t dragging on.

Previous Owners The fact that they wouldn’t put any more money in, is not a crime, it’s morally irreprehensible, but it’s not a crime.  [Strictly speaking the Administrators are the current owners, they didn't have to take the job on.  Are they as owners putting 'their' money into the club/waive their fees and if they aren't isn't that morally irreprehensible too?  Just a thought! - Sluffy]
Of all the people that have come to me, maybe one has been a Wigan fan, the others? It’s just a vehicle to do something, that’s how it’s looked on. You don’t find Dave Whelans anymore.

Sharpey’s I’m not going to tell you how much we’re going to be getting for the Chippy, that’s confidential, but also we haven’t sold it yet and we may not sell it, we haven’t decided yet. We’ve had a good bid, but whether we will break it up, it isn’t like the other training ground (Euxton), everyone we spoke to wanted that and to sell it on at a profit, not one bidder was looking at that as a training ground for Wigan, so criticise me for selling it, but I’ve sold it and there are reasons for selling it, to get the offer price down.  
If the Chippy is sold separately it will go into the property company. But it may have to fund some of the shortfall in the football club, we’ve got a loss in the football club of £3m.

Players Coming Out Of Contracts I don’t deal with the players, its Paul Stanley who deals with that side of the admin, he liaises with the manager and the players.

Bidders Since yesterday morning it’s changed, I’ve lost one and gained one, we’ve got that many contracts out because they all want different things, surely someone is going to sign, that’s not borne out of hope, that’s my gut feel after all these years of doing it, when I can’t say, I get emails every day, but things change rapidly, though the people who came in yesterday morning are still there, that hasn’t changed overnight. I emailed them the NDA and it was back in 2 minutes, very quick, doing their due diligence on the club in the data room all day today. I’m very optimistic.
As soon as there is something definite, by that I mean money shown and signature I won’t wait to call a press conference, I will just announce it, I will put it on the website, do a press release, but even then from what they are telling me, is none of the bidders what their identity disclosed in any way.

https://progresswithunity.blogspot.com/2020/09/gerald-krasner-pt-5.html?m=1

338Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Sep 30 2020, 17:55

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
DONE DEAL???

“We are pleased to announce that we have reached agreement with a preferred bidder from Spain. The offer that has been accepted deals with not only the sale of the club but also allows the payment to non-football creditors to avoid the 15-point penalty this season. In addition, a substantial deposit has been received. We are now working with our lawyers and the bidder to produce all of the necessary paperwork to submit to the EFL so that successful transfer of the football share can be made at the earliest opportunity. The preferred bidder who has experience in football has made it plain that they do not wish for their details to be made public until such time as the sale is completed and we are respecting this anonymity. No further details will be released until EFL approval has been obtained.”

https://wiganathletic.com/news/2020/september/Update-Statement-From-The-Joint-Administrators-30-09-20-/


339Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Sep 30 2020, 20:59

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
The young lad has done it again - interview with the Administrator following the above announcement from them -



340Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Sep 30 2020, 23:57

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Spanish group? You have to wonder if Roberto Martinez or any of their other Spanish ex-players/managers were involved?

341Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 07:26

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
This news is going  to upset some of the Wayne Linekers on WW, aka Ageing Adolescents.

342Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 09:33

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:This news is going  to upset some of the Wayne Linekers on WW, aka Ageing Adolescents.

Birds of a feather on there, they've chased off (read that as personally abused and/or simply banned) anybody who says differently to them over the years.

I still am utterly amazed that someone wants to buy them and sink their millions into them - circa £3.5m purchase price and the Admin said only yesterday current running costs of £600k pm, so a further £7.2m.

They will get an amount from the EFL - a 'solidarity' payment, that apparently all clubs get of £2.5m but I'm not sure if that's a loan or not, plus about £1m Sky money.

Once sold they can also sell ST's but who but hardcore fans of there's will buy them whilst now being able to watch the game from home on the video service for £10 a game?  And will they go back to the ground when the pandemic is over - which remember ran at an annual loss before all of this?

The numbers don't stack up to me - then again I still don't know what the plan is at Bolton other than for Sharon to fund it from her own purse?

Whilst saying I'm amazed it's sold (but lets not forget there's many a slip twixt cup and lips yet) I'm equally not surprised at all of this in the football world!

Indeed apparently a couple of other bids came in the same day (which leads me to suspect the Administrators were working to a timescale on the sale that they hadn't informed the public of).

The gossip was last night that the plan from the prospective new owners (who own/owned a club in Italy) is to do own a number of clubs in different country's and move their players across their teams - similar to what Watford did a few years back.  Who knows?

At least Wigan's woes have kept me intellectually amused with them if nothing else for the last three months.

I don't think they are out of the woods yet and everything will be plain sailing for them for now on if you forgive me for mixing my metaphors.

343Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 09:47

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
You can count Wigan's hardcore fans on one six fingered hand  Very Happy

344Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 10:10

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Norpig wrote:You can count Wigan's hardcore fans on one six fingered hand  Very Happy
Shouldn't you be with the Ageing Adolescents or are you there as well?

345Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 11:47

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
@Norpig wrote:You can count Wigan's hardcore fans on one six fingered hand  Very Happy
Shouldn't you be with the Ageing Adolescents or are you there as well?

To be fair I don't believe Norpig fits into that category as such.

He might not take my side many times on here but he's always shown himself to be loyal (even too loyal at times) to his mates on the forum at a cost of being less prepared to listen to/understand the opposite side of the story at times.

He's never been abusive (bar that recent outburst to you, which he accepts he went a bit too far with) and doesn't seem to have delusions of himself to be some sort of middle aged hard nut or as a sort of a well paid professional career employee through the day and 'Fight Club' persona when not!

I was always taught by my dad (who fwiw was special services trained during the war on how to kill the enemy at close quarters) that jaw, jaw is always a better way to go than war, war - to walk away from fights when you are able to and to fight only as a last resort.

Testosterone and aggression has always seemed to be endemic with a hardcore of fans following football in my time (and fwiw again, spilled over on to social media as well, since it was invented - keyboard warriors and all that!)

I'm sure Norpig doesn't fit that profile, but is simply a bit cheesed off with you (as he often is with me!) from time to time.

There's no malice in him in my opinion.

346Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 12:17

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
To be honest i'm past caring what the boring old codger thinks about anything. He's like a senile geriatric that's managed to escape from his secure ward.

347Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 12:41

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Norpig wrote:To be honest i'm past caring what the boring old codger thinks about anything. He's like a senile geriatric that's managed to escape from his secure ward.

Bonce is ok as long as you don't click the links.

348Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 12:41

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
No malice in him at all, Sluffy. Perish the thought.

He's as blameless, unassuming and sincere as that poor Mr Holdsworth, the saviour of Bolton Wanderers. Have you not got it in your heart to recant your opinion of him and admit that you got it all wrong?

349Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 13:31

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:No malice in him at all, Sluffy. Perish the thought.

He's as blameless, unassuming and sincere as that poor Mr Holdsworth, the saviour of Bolton Wanderers. Have you not got it in your heart to recant your opinion of him and admit that you got it all wrong?

Well I can only speak as I see it.

I don't believe anyone (and I include Wanderlust, TROY and others I've bumped heads with who are currently on here) are malicious in the slightest.

I'm not saying any of them are perfect, nor even myself, but I reckon most if not all of them would do you a good turn in real life rather than a bad one.

I'm not sure what you mean with your comment about Holdsworth though, I'm certainly no supporter of his and Norpig posted just the other day that he thought Holdsworth was as bad as Anderson in his view - and he's certainly not a lover of Anderson by any stretch of the imagination!

I don't think anyone on Nuts now believes that Holdsworth wasn't here for anything other than what he could screw out of the club as per his 'set up' of the BluMarble loan.

Only Iles and the ST are still on Team Dean these days I believe!

350Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 14:06

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Sluffy wrote:

Well I can only speak as I see it.

I don't believe anyone (and I include Wanderlust, TROY and others I've bumped heads with who are currently on here) are malicious in the slightest.

I'm not saying any of them are perfect, nor even myself, but I reckon most if not all of them would do you a good turn in real life rather than a bad one.

I'm not sure what you mean with your comment about Holdsworth though, I'm certainly no supporter of his and Norpig posted just the other day that he thought Holdsworth was as bad as Anderson in his view - and he's certainly not a lover of Anderson by any stretch of the imagination!

I don't think anyone on Nuts now believes that Holdsworth wasn't here for anything other than what he could screw out of the club as per his 'set up' of the BluMarble loan.

Only Iles and the ST are still on Team Dean these days I believe!
I think the irony might have gone undetected, Sluffy, but I cannot see that anyone on here or on Ageing Adolescents has called out the Beeb for this week portraying Holdsworth as the poor innocent, injured party and star witness in the troubles of BWFC.

351Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:01

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
I think the irony might have gone undetected, Sluffy, but I cannot see that anyone on here or on Ageing Adolescents has called out the Beeb for this week portraying Holdsworth as the poor innocent, injured party and star witness in the troubles of BWFC.
When we discussed it - at considerable length - we came to the conclusion that as none of us were there in the meetings and that only one side of the story came out and that the accounts were delayed for a considerable period of time, nothing could be proven one way or the other against either Holdsworth or Anderson. Or Eddie for that matter.
Everyone has an opinion about what really went on but that's all we had and we'd still be arguing about who did what to whom today if we hadn't agreed to disagree in the absence of facts.
We really don't want to go down that path again unless defining information emerges. So as far as we know, Holdsworth actually could have been the well-intentioned, innocent injured party.

352Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:30

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
And btw, Sluffy, if anyone understands the Holdsworth position better now, where have they got their information from?

Let me tell you where they haven't got the information from:

The Beeno
The Guardian
The Times
The Telegraph
The Mirror
The Sun
The Beeb 
Sky
Talksport
Kieran Maguire

Need I go on?

Can you provide me with one media outlet where the full facts about Blumarble or the money that was taken out by Holdsworth or the other costs the club faced as a consequence of Holdsworth has been reported in any coherent way, or anyway at all for that matter?

The Nuts cabal don't want to know the facts and they don't want anyone else to know them either. That's the problem, just as it was with the majority on Ageing Adolescents.

353Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:35

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Where do you get your info Bob?

354Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:46

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
We are all forgetting that nine bob knows more than anyone else on here and see us all as plebs.

355Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:52

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@boltonbonce wrote:Where do you get your info Bob?
Long story Boncey but it helps if you've advised hundreds of businesses, know where to look, understand what makes sense and what doesn't, recognise the tell tale signs of the charlatan, look not just at what you see but recognise what's missing.

There are often loads of clues and sometimes your instinct immediately draws you to the 'sore thumb'. You could say its professional experience but tbf any decent tradesman would recognise a cowboy in an instant.

Just take a quick look at this file for example. It tells you loads or it should if you knew what you were doing.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/09910069/filing-history

Has Maguire looked at this file? He should have and so should the Beeb.

356Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 15:55

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
If only Rammy was still around to inform us on these kind of issues, it was all explained in a way us blockheads could understand, but no, we have to put up with condescending nine bob instead  Rolling Eyes

357Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 18:07

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
The young man does another interview - he puts Iles coverage of our admin to utter shame!

358Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 20:03

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:And btw, Sluffy, if anyone understands the Holdsworth position better now, where have they got their information from?

Let me tell you where they haven't got the information from:

The Beeno
The Guardian
The Times
The Telegraph
The Mirror
The Sun
The Beeb 
Sky
Talksport
Kieran Maguire

Need I go on?

Can you provide me with one media outlet where the full facts about Blumarble or the money that was taken out by Holdsworth or the other costs the club faced as a consequence of Holdsworth has been reported in any coherent way, or anyway at all for that matter?

The Nuts cabal don't want to know the facts and they don't want anyone else to know them either. That's the problem, just as it was with the majority on Ageing Adolescents.
Still like an answer Sluffy
Where is the evidence that the facts about Holdsworth are now known and understood
Isn’t it plain that they aren’t and that there’s still a heads in the sand culture over what really happened?

359Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 21:21

T.R.O.Y.


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
There seems to have been this weird narrative emerge where all Bolton fans were enamoured with Holdsworth and only Sluff and Ten Bob’s vast accounting knowledge revealed the truth to us simpletons.

Wasn’t Holdsworth partnered with Jonathan Disley to begin with? I think the majority on here were against him and suspicious of Holdsworth as a result. 

Holdsworth then replaces Disley with KA - more slimeballs and no money. Nobody ever thought this was a white knight riding in to save the day. So not sure what this ‘head in the sands’ criticism is referring to.

360Wigan in Administration - Page 12 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Thu Oct 01 2020, 22:54

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:And btw, Sluffy, if anyone understands the Holdsworth position better now, where have they got their information from?

Let me tell you where they haven't got the information from:

The Beeno
The Guardian
The Times
The Telegraph
The Mirror
The Sun
The Beeb 
Sky
Talksport
Kieran Maguire

Need I go on?

Can you provide me with one media outlet where the full facts about Blumarble or the money that was taken out by Holdsworth or the other costs the club faced as a consequence of Holdsworth has been reported in any coherent way, or anyway at all for that matter?

The Nuts cabal don't want to know the facts and they don't want anyone else to know them either. That's the problem, just as it was with the majority on Ageing Adolescents.
Still like an answer Sluffy
Where is the evidence that the facts about Holdsworth are now known and understood
Isn’t it plain that they aren’t and that there’s still a heads in the sand culture over what really happened?

Oh sorry, I thought it was a rhetorical question you were asking actually.

As you full well know nothing meaningful as ever been said about BluMarble by most - particularly lax about it being our local papers esteemed journalist who even as recently as the last few days still turns a blind eye to probably the most watershed moment the club had in respect of its future existence - and I'm not being overly dramatic about that!

Really there's only ever been three sources available to us, namely what we could gleam from Companies House's public records, statements made by Ken Anderson and you good self with your professional expertise of being able to better interpret and dissect the public Company House records and marry them up with information KA had made known to us.

I like to think I was somewhere along that trail before I became aware of your work but I give you full recognition for patiently explaining to me at least some/many of the facets to what had happened/was going on that I had missed or not understood.

Even now I don't think I've got an absolutely clear picture as to all that has happened and why - for instance Eddie must have know Holdsworth didn't have £5m to secure a loan against nor service or repay the debt - so would not in himself actually put anything into the pot, so why did he allow him to buy the club knowing the shit was obviously going to hit the fan when the repayment day fell due?  It's clear from Eddie subsequent actions that he would never let the club go bust, so what was going on?

Anyway water under the bridge.  You came closer to anybody else who wasn't actually in the know, what was going on and I'm only to pleased to acknowledge that.

As for a cabal of people on here not wanting to know the facts, I don't think that is fair comment personally.

On one hand you had the paid, professional, journalist from the local paper, the official clubs Supporters Trust full Board AND even Holdsworth himself putting forward a public, and on the face of it, authoritative account of goings on at the club and on the other hand a person who had just served a full an EIGHT YEAR ban from holding a directorship in a company and who was now the widely portrayed the bad guy in all of this with just two random blokes on social media (you and I) saying, based on our professional experience in companies and how they work, there's something not right in Holdsworth actions and what Anderson was saying not only made sense but seemed to be bourn out from what little information in the public domain we could gleam.

I'm all for not trusting anyone on social media so why should I expect anyone to trust anything I was saying on it either?

The likelihood based on the key 'influencers' to the masses, namely Iles, the ST and a former player who may even be described by some as a fan favourite, stacked up against 'Sweaty' Ken and two perceived lunatics off social media, clearly meant that anyone taking things at face value would naturally believe the former and obviously think anyone taking Anderson's side to be absolutely barking mad.

The thing that set's us apart from the rest though Bob is that we are one of the few these days that likes to satisfy ourselves what as happened than simply take as gospel what people who others clearly trust/respect (Iles and the ST leadership) tell them.

It's clearly hard for some people to admit they are wrong/been duped and many are still in denial but slowly, slowly, some/many have now come to realise what in fact did happen and that it was close to if not bob on the narrative we had been saying throughout.

If Norpig who absolutely detested Anderson can now equate Holdsworth as being his equal now, then I see that as people taking their heads out of the sand and now accepting a great deal more as to what went on at the time.

The thing though is that people don't want to go over it all again, it was an unpleasant time for them on and off the pitch and they are just pleased now to put it all behind them and move on.

If you're looking for some sort of recognition for being correct - which of course you were, you ain't going to get it from anyone but my humble self, I suspect.

If you want people to exonerate Anderson and recognise the way he kept an insolvent business going for such a long time, you aren't going to see it - Anderson is forever fixed in their minds as the bad guy.

If you hoped that Iles would skulk off with his tail between his legs it won't be happening, there's still plenty who still hangs on his every word.

It is what it is unfortunately.

I'm not religious in the slightest but the best analogy I can come up with is when Jesus was on the cross and said "forgive them for they know not what they do", so don't be too hard on people on this forum doing the wrong things but believing at the time that they were the right things to be doing.

We all make mistakes, I know I do, so as someone once said (Alexander Pope) "to err is human, to forgive divine".

Just let it go mate and lets all move on together eh?

We know we were right isn't that good enough.

It is for me.

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