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Bolton Nuts » BWFC » Wandering Minds » Wigan in Administration

Wigan in Administration

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571Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Dec 08 2020, 17:41

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:Companies House shows that the shares in AFC Wigan Athletic (£100) were transferred from Antonio Garrido Papadopaulo to a Spanish real  estate company, Hause La Fuente, based in Leganes, on 5 December 2020.

Make of that what you will.

If I've followed the story correctly (I've not fact checked everything as I would be with Bolton for instance) Papadopaulo is the brother of Cristo, the bloke who failed the EFL's Fit and Proper test.

Although Papadopaulo passed he's seen to be too closely associated with his brother to continue in the process and apparently (according to Nixon) has sold his shares to another Spaniard called Moreno who apparently is very wealthy and the one who wanted the club all along - although it begs the question why as he ever been involved with the Cristo brothers in the first place and why he didn't put this extra £1m in if he could easily afford to do?  

I assume therefore the real estate company who now is the major shareholder of the company AFC Wigan belongs to Moreno?

Papadopaulo and the woman who is his brothers accountant have both resigned as Directors of the company and replaced by Andrew James Clilvered who apparently was some sort of 'agent' I use the term loosely as I don't real understand what is role in all this is.

However it's been mentioned that this Clilvered attempted to fix up a sale with Moreno (I think?) to buy the club BEFORE the Hong Kong bloke did and has done the same again with the Cristo brothers, with Moreno staying in the background - as someone (I thought?) to be the moneyman - a bit like Anderson to Holdsworth if you will - although I don't know if that is an accurate description of their roles in this?

Anyway something doesn't ring true to me but for now anyway it seems Moreno is favourite to buy the club.

572Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Dec 08 2020, 22:17

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
This is what infoimpresa have to say about Hause La Fuenta:

https://www.infoempresa.com/en-in/es/company/hause-la-fuente-sl#tab-directors

And this is Dun and Bradstreet's version:

https://www.dnb.com/business-directory/company-profiles.hause_la_fuente_sl.daf2e5efe545f5f10608500775a7d22f.html#company-info

Will it all become clear in due course? I wouldn't put money on it.

I reckon you could ask a hundred Bolton supporters about the present financial structure of BWFC and be lucky to find one that had any idea.

573Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Dec 08 2020, 23:26

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Thanks Bob, I suspect it will never become clear, why else all the palaver with him/them/whoever expecting the Wigan Supporters to put in their £850k they collected - which they wouldn't, then the dodgy Spaniard putting in his £1m instead, which the EFL threw out, to now this questionable real estate company becoming on paper the potential new owners of the club!

Doesn't strike me as being all above board but then again the EFL seems happy with Moreno and they are the ones whose opinion matters.

As for the financial structure of BWFC, I'm not sure I even know it myself, so we can't be too hard on the fans who don't even know anything about company finances to begin with!

Hope Sharon has long arms and deep pockets though otherwise we may find ourselves in the sticky stuff again sooner or later.

Fingers crossed though that things go well for us all although the Port Vale result showed there's a long way to go yet though.

574Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 08:37

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
You will recall, Sluffy, that 'the fans who don't even know anything about company finances to begin with' were whipped up into a lynch mob by the local media, social media and the Supporters Trust. And it was all too easy because the fans who didn't know anything didn't want to know anything that conflicted with their prejudices and they still don't.


The present position is that FV are disclosing only those things that they are legally obliged to disclose whilst the Supporters Trust and the BN remain just as clueless as they always seem to have been.


The young guy at Wigan, Jay Whittle, might not be getting all the answers but at least he seems to be making a decent effort.

575Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 11:40

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Fair play to young Jay but it also needs to be weighed against the want/need/desire for those he's interviewed to speak to him, I doubt he would have got the Administrators or Ken Anderson to talk publicly - then again you never know until you are asked and Iles certainly didn't try much to get the story - the same can be said about his equivalent on the Wigan paper.

As for our 'fans who didn't know anything didn't want to know anything that conflicted with their prejudices and they still don't', well that is very true but unfortunately that is the same the whole world over on any issue let alone little old BWFC.

There is a great deal of ignorance and prejudice out there and not too many people who rather check out the stuff that is being said than take it as gospel.

I guess it's always has been that way through history but since the introduction of social media it simply has shot off the scale.

We even have people on here who post what they've read on Facebook or twitter as 'fact' and clearly have no idea of the reality of the situation, only just that these 'facts' they've read off there supported their existing beliefs and prejudices.

I would say even less people know how government actually works in respect of what the civil servants do and what the politicians don't but I bet you at least 99 out of 100 people you ask believe that Tory MP's have given hundreds of millions of pounds to their mates during the pandemic - yet it is the civil servants who have total control over the awarding of contracts!

If anything dodgy went on it would have to have been done by a civil servant NOT an MP - and personally I doubt career public servants at that level to influence such awards are the type to do that.

Sadly people (including many clever ones) are inclined to believe anything you feed them as long as it feeds into their existing bias/prejudice/mindset and gives them 'reinforcement' to the belief they were 'right' all along.

They were 'right' about Anderson, 'he was a bad 'un from the beginning, never should have had him' and they are 'right' about the Tory bastards giving massive contracts to their mates, 'they all look after themselves and their mates that lot do' - and when at the end of the day and after official inquiry's have gone on, looked into everything and found nothing amiss, they say 'oh well it was always going to be a cover up wasn't it'!

No it wasn't, the inquiry's simply find out the truth of the matter and if it doesn't match with what people expected then it isn't a cover up, it is them in denial of what actually happened wasn't what they thought had happened and they can't except that, so are in denial of it - many always will be.

Empty vessels make the most noise they, shame some people don't fill up on the facts before sounding off on social media perhaps?

But we know that's never going to happen is it?

We get what we deserve I suppose.

576Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 11:49

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
If your plan was to further alienate posters on here who don't meet you or ten bobs supposed higher intellect then well done Sluffy it's working a treat  Rolling Eyes

577Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 12:00

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Norpig wrote:If your plan was to further alienate posters on here who don't meet you or ten bobs supposed higher intellect then well done Sluffy it's working a treat  Rolling Eyes
"Higher intellect?"

:rofl:

578Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 12:25

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Norpig wrote:If your plan was to further alienate posters on here who don't meet you or ten bobs supposed higher intellect then well done Sluffy it's working a treat  Rolling Eyes

I'm just stating what is true.

What have I said that isn't?

Anderson HASN'T been found wrong of any wrong doing by the representatives of the court.

Civil servants put government policy into practice - not MP's.

Most people have little understanding of Company Law or how government functions.

People still think Anderson was a crook even though he's been 'investigated' and people on here have already said the inquiries into PPE procurement during covid would be a 'cover up' if they don't find 'cronyism' from MP's to their mates to be the case.

What people 'believe' to be the case and what 'factually' is the case are often two completely separate things - sometimes a simple bit of research, even as basic as googling Wikipedia, can give them a better understanding of what actually is going on, rather than what the social media 'crowd' says is happening.

It really isn't hard NOT to believe everything that is said on social media - even on here - you don't even have to believe me - but just simply check out a few facts for yourself before you join the lynch mobs.

That's all I've ever been saying and you don't have to be the Brain of Britain to spend a few moments, find a few facts and make your own mind up about things than simply following the crowds on Facebook or Twitter.

Is that so unreasonable of me to say such things?

579Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 12:32

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
All those things may be true Sluffy but the way you come across to the rest of us mere mortals leaves a lot to be desired sometimes. 

As for Wikipedia, hardly a reliable source is it when anyone can amend any article on there.

580Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 12:55

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Norpig wrote:All those things may be true Sluffy but the way you come across to the rest of us mere mortals leaves a lot to be desired sometimes. 

As for Wikipedia, hardly a reliable source is it when anyone can amend any article on there.

If you cut me then I bleed to, I'm no different to you or anyone else, I'm certainly not special or claim to be, I just tend to not believe everything I read or am told, most people seem happy to accept as fact what is put in front of them - I've no idea why they do that, or even wish to do that?

As for Wikipedia then again don't take the source as definitive but on most 'boring' things like how governments function, they are more likely to be reasonably accurate than say a football who has just be transferred to a rival club.

Wiki gives you a 'starting point' an 'opening' an entry level access if you will to get some idea of what you are looking for in order for you to search further into it if you needed to.

Do you really think that I'm making myself out to be superior to you and others when all I virtually say is DON'T take social media as gospel and DO check out the facts for yourself.

That's all I do and I'm certainly not the one on here who told us that he has a MBA from a 'superior' awarding body!!!

:rofl:

And even if he did he still voted for Brexit!

581Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 13:06

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Again Sluffy all good traits to have but please stop and re-read some of your posts before hitting send. You do have a habit of coming over as being patronising and all knowing and that others on here are just sheep who believe any old tripe.

582Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Dec 09 2020, 13:48

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Norpig wrote:Again Sluffy all good traits to have but please stop and re-read some of your posts before hitting send. You do have a habit of coming over as being patronising and all knowing and that others on here are just sheep who believe any old tripe.

Well sometimes if you KNOW the way things work and people fully belief different to you, then I guess what I say may seem to be seen as patronising and that people ARE believing some old tripe.

I wouldn't dream of telling you that you don't know your job that you have spent many years in and no doubt had professional training in, or that you were talking out of your arse on the subject.  I wouldn't post abuse about what you say when you attempt to correct my misunderstanding and lack of knowledge about it.

I might not accept that you are an expert or anything simply because you are just another random person on the internet and I only have your word that you do the job you do BUT I would wind my neck in a bit and stop repeating stuff off social media (from other random people on the internet who I don't know from Adam) until I was more certain of my facts.

That simply doesn't happen, not even on here.

I've never wanted Nuts to simply be yet another place where the truth is drowned out by prejudice and ignorance.

Is that a bad thing of me to want?

Anyway its only the internet, I can't change how people behave and what they want to believe in real life - maybe they are right and we are ruled by lizards disguised as humans who are paedophile devil worshippers.

People believe what they want to I suppose regardless of any facts or whether it clearly is utter tripe or not.

583Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 12:52

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Wigan's Spanish bidders have effectively got cold feet and walked off!!!

They've reduced their bid by half, will refuse to pay non football creditors and demanded they won't get a further 15 point penalty for doing this knowing that isn't possible under EFL rules - and thus forcing the Administrators to end their preferred bidder status with them.

STATEMENT FROM THE JOINT ADMINISTRATORS (05.01.21)

The Joint Administrators wish to provide an update regarding the current position.

As of 11 am today, the Administrators have broken off negotiations with the Spanish bidder. The facts are that as late as Christmas Eve the Bidder indicated that they wanted to complete the deal immediately and had wired money from Spain to their UK solicitors. This was confirmed as being received by their solicitors over the Christmas period. The sale contract was agreed, the documentation had been signed in relation to the assignment of the leases with the Council (Stadium) and College (Training Ground) and completion was planned to take place in between Christmas and New Year.

However, over this weekend we received a letter from the Bidder reducing the bid by almost 50%.  This would not allow us to pay non-football creditors the required 25p in the £ to avoid further sanctions against the Club. This would result in a 15 point deduction and would effectively relegate the Club to League 2. The Purchaser was insistent on offering the reduced price but was not prepared to conclude the deal unless the 15 point deduction was waived.  Under the EFL insolvency policy, this is not possible and the deal is therefore unable to be concluded.

We have informed the EFL and are now starting to talk to other bidders who have expressed interest and will provide an update when there is any definite news.

https://wiganathletic.com/news/2021/january/Statement-From-The-Joint-Administrators-05-01-21-/

584Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 13:41

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Did they reduce the bid because they thought relegation was likely or just chancing their arm?

585Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 13:44

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Not entirely unexpected wouldn't you say, Sluffy? I would.

I'm still waiting for Lusty's expert assessment of BWFC's financial position. Do you think I might have to wait a while?

586Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 22:14

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Norpig wrote:Did they reduce the bid because they thought relegation was likely or just chancing their arm?

I've no idea to be honest but I rather suspect it was neither of those.

I won't bore you by retelling the whole saga but my view is that they never had the money in the first place, they tried to get the Supporters Group to put in their £850k and I think they smelt a rat and kept away from them since, then the bloke who was buying the club (with his brother) tried to put £1m in the pot and the EFL obviously didn't like where the money originated from, then the money man said that he was buying the club all by himself anyway (why didn't he just do that in the first place then?) and the Administrators (who I'm not at all impressed with on a professional level) let it be known that the money was there, they said that the EFL was happy and all was left to do was sign and exchange contracts - yet nothing happened for weeks until this!  Clearly all wasn't as rosy as they were painting things were they!

I've no idea why anyone would want to buy a club in normal circumstances (most of them run at a loss and depend on benevolent owners funding the shortfall from their own pockets), so why anyone would want to buy a financially bust club who can't fill their stadium when fans are allowed in anyway, in the middle of a worldwide pandemic and with no chance of making a return on their money is beyond my understanding.

Saying that though there seem to be at least three other groups looking to buy, one headed by someone called Frampton (ex pat Wiganer) whose own daughter took to social media to tell the world he can't be trusted!, another involving Ray Ransom (who was behind Coventry City selling their stadium and effectively who have been homeless since) and the Supporters Group who clearly can't fund a league team - they have worked miracles to collect £850k from crowd funding but compare that to needing £1.5m per season just on players wages and that being in the fourth division like we are.

As far as I can understand it the Administrators only get paid if they sell the club and the only asset they have is the ground - and that's why the deal is £1 for the club and £3m for the ground but you have to buy both - the EFL will not sanction a sale if the club hasn't a guaranteed venue to play it's games on.

My guess is that some deal will be concocted whereby the rugby club will buy the ground, the Supporters Club take on the club but still play at the ground and the Council finds some means of helping the club albeit they are constrained in using public money for private businesses (if the Supporters Club becomes a not for profit organisation then this might be a way around this issue?)

All in all it is a mess for them and anything more than survival will be a bonus for them I would imagine.

587Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 22:36

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:Not entirely unexpected wouldn't you say, Sluffy? I would.

I'm still waiting for Lusty's expert assessment of BWFC's financial position. Do you think I might have to wait a while?

Well I can't say I'm surprised but at the same time I still can't understand why FV bought us, so I wouldn't have been shocked if the sale had gone through either!

It did have a bad smell to it all though.

As for Wanderlust you've clearly sussed him out too and I certainly suggest you don't hold your breath until you get a reply from him because you won't be getting one.

Wanderlust has told us all about how he is a Financial Advisor and how he's done important work for various public bodies in such a capacity and told us he has an MBA (from a premier awarding body no less!), he's also told us how Anderson raped and pillaged the clubs assets to line his own pockets and repeatedly ignored my many requests as to what assets these were, as there wasn't any to be sold off in the first place!

I know you like to refer to Walter from 'Nearest and Dearest' but I think you also have another Walter on your hands with Wanderlust, Walter Mitty!

588Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Tue Jan 05 2021, 23:50

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I was quite interested in this thread and was on the point of asking your opinion regarding the similarities between Wigan's position in the League One table as ours at the time we (allegedly) had international investment rumours related to our survival struggle - and how that may affect investor perspective.
But then you two sad tosspots started whingeing on about my degrees and career. Surprised you didn't manage to squeeze in a snide remark about my footie - which you'll be pleased to know is off the menu for now.
You really are sad as fuck.
And Bob - I'm not interested in your thread no matter how desperate you get my attention you become. It just makes me be rude - which I really don't want to be. Try being humorous and provide some entertainment like the good folks of this parish. And the Albertos.

589Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 00:10

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Hahaha!

Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Pinocchio-nose

You ask MY opinion on anything...

...yeah right!!!

...as though that would ever happen!

:rofl:


You do make me laugh!!!

Anyway -

Begbies Traynor Administrator Paul Stanley on Wigan Athletic's Spanish takeover falling through.

590Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 08:01

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Sluffy wrote:

Well I can't say I'm surprised but at the same time I still can't understand why FV bought us, so I wouldn't have been shocked if the sale had gone through either!

It did have a bad smell to it all though.

As for Wanderlust you've clearly sussed him out too and I certainly suggest you don't hold your breath until you get a reply from him because you won't be getting one.

Wanderlust has told us all about how he is a Financial Advisor and how he's done important work for various public bodies in such a capacity and told us he has an MBA (from a premier awarding body no less!), he's also told us how Anderson raped and pillaged the clubs assets to line his own pockets and repeatedly ignored my many requests as to what assets these were, as there wasn't any to be sold off in the first place!

I know you like to refer to Walter from 'Nearest and Dearest' but I think you also have another Walter on your hands with Wanderlust, Walter Mitty!

You two won't be happy till you've driven everyone away and it's just the two of you left will you?  Rolling Eyes

591Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:04

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Norpig wrote:
You two won't be happy till you've driven everyone away and it's just the two of you left will you?  Rolling Eyes
Mummy, mummy, Norpig keeps skriking. I think he wants his dummy back.

592Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:16

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
Mummy, mummy, Norpig keeps skriking. I think he wants his dummy back.
My Mum is dead but thanks for asking about her, by the way you are still boring  Very Happy

593Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:37

Ten Bobsworth


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Norpig wrote:
My Mum is dead but thanks for asking about her, by the way you are still boring  Very Happy
And you are still a pea-brained pillock.

594Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:41

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
And you are still a pea-brained pillock.
And proud of it, this will be my last reply to you, it's been pointed out that i'm only giving you more oxygen so that's the last you'll hear from me you'll be pleased to hear.

595Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:41

finlaymcdanger

finlaymcdanger
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
@Ten Bobsworth wrote:
And you are still a pea-brained pillock.

Just stop! Every time I come in here it’s that same bullshit. Just give it a rest.

596Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 10:45

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Norpig wrote:
@Sluffy wrote:

Well I can't say I'm surprised but at the same time I still can't understand why FV bought us, so I wouldn't have been shocked if the sale had gone through either!

It did have a bad smell to it all though.

As for Wanderlust you've clearly sussed him out too and I certainly suggest you don't hold your breath until you get a reply from him because you won't be getting one.

Wanderlust has told us all about how he is a Financial Advisor and how he's done important work for various public bodies in such a capacity and told us he has an MBA (from a premier awarding body no less!), he's also told us how Anderson raped and pillaged the clubs assets to line his own pockets and repeatedly ignored my many requests as to what assets these were, as there wasn't any to be sold off in the first place!

I know you like to refer to Walter from 'Nearest and Dearest' but I think you also have another Walter on your hands with Wanderlust, Walter Mitty!

You two won't be happy till you've driven everyone away and it's just the two of you left will you?  Rolling Eyes

I agree.

It's just beyond ridiculous this now.

Two grown men who should know better.

597Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 11:10

finlaymcdanger

finlaymcdanger
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
Where is our leader, Nat? Flounced off for a couple of weeks again? Gone for good? What’s the story?

598Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 11:13

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
She's probably had enough of all this shit Fin and I can't blame her.

599Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 11:15

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@karlypants wrote:She's probably had enough of all this shit Fin and I can't blame her.
She comes back to post on the prediction threads, the crafty old cow. I think she's having a face lift.

600Wigan in Administration - Page 20 Empty Re: Wigan in Administration Wed Jan 06 2021, 11:18

finlaymcdanger

finlaymcdanger
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
@boltonbonce wrote:
She comes back to post on the prediction threads, the crafty old cow. I think she's having a face lift.
Front or back?

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