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Bolton Nuts » BWFC » Bolton Wanderers Banter » Dean Holdsworth quits Brentwood Town

Dean Holdsworth quits Brentwood Town

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FullofSprite
Bwfc1958
JAH
carl baxter
observer
wanderlust
Norpig
finlaymcdanger
Hipster_Nebula
bwfc71
Natasha Whittam
scottjames30
karlypants
Boggersbelief
BoltonTillIDie
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wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Breadman wrote:It doesn't say that BFS and Kid Sunbed will be involved though, does it?

It says that "initial reports suggested it" and all that means is, they were mentioned in the original piece on LoVS.

Which we all read last week.

So that's not new info, nor is it confirmation that the initial reports have any credence.

Come on, Lusty - Don't get all "Whittam" on us, read it properly.  Very Happy
Agree that bit's recycled. Just saying it seems unlikely seeing as they're contracted elsewhere. 
It's the bit about us turning down bids in the past ostensibly on the basis that the future of the club couldn't be guaranteed that I haven't read before. Of course, that could be PR versioning of events.

I have a question though:

How many graduates of the academy in the last 10 years are no longer professional footballers? Exclude those who had to quit through injury.

Guest


Guest

"PR versioning of events".........?

Or as we say round our way, "made-up bollocks".  Very Happy

No idea regarding the academy question.

You doing that Barrister thing where you already know the answer and are skilfully setting a trap?

Sneaky bastard......

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

wanderlust wrote:

How many graduates of the academy in the last 10 years are no longer professional footballers? Exclude those who had to quit through injury.

Impossible to say but put the question the other way, how many of them have we sold and gone on to better things?

None.

Basham was sold for a million to Blackpool and failed there.

Walters (who we got from another academy iirc) left the club for nothing and eventually turned up and did well at Stoke.

Mooy plays for Australia but he too was released after rejecting a contract with us - he left for St Mirren.

The academy would have run at a significant net loss since it was established.

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Sluffy wrote:
wanderlust wrote:

How many graduates of the academy in the last 10 years are no longer professional footballers? Exclude those who had to quit through injury.

Impossible to say but put the question the other way, how many of them have we sold and gone on to better things?

None.

Basham was sold for a million to Blackpool and failed there.

Walters (who we got from another academy iirc) left the club for nothing and eventually turned up and did well at Stoke.

Mooy plays for Australia but he too was released after rejecting a contract with us - he left for St Mirren.

The academy would have run at a significant net loss since it was established.

The lower leagues are littered with former BWFC academy players and a few have gone on to the higher level in the UK and abroad - and some play for us. I think that considering the big clubs have first draft pick of young talent, the academy has done alright.
I think the problem is that we don't set our stall out to sell them at the right time for the right price and we could easily have picked up a few hundred grand here and there for the lesser lights if we'd been astute enough to let them go at the right time.

Unfortunately, we have been absolutely shit at trading over the last ten years, and that applies equally to the first team squad as the Academy. Our recent track record is one of of selling players on at a loss, or running down contracts until there is no value, or selling better players way too cheaply.

When Rioch et al rebuilt the club, we were always finding bargains which meant that it wasn't so bad when they moved on for a whopping profit but those days are long gone and now we just give players away.
IMO the Academy could have been financially viable even if we were just preparing players of L1 and 2 standard, but that would only have happened if we had been far more business savvy. They needn't necessarily go on to better things - they just need to bring in more money than was spent on them, although it would have been nice if we had a steady stream of talent that could enhance our first team.

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Sluffy wrote:Personally I think everything about the club, a takeover, and how we should spend future investment is all bollocks.

Somebody has to put money into the club - to make money but who will do that and how will they make their money back?

Davies clearly isn't pumping any money in - clearly he sees it as throwing more good money after bad.

The directors - who lets remember are in a fantastic position to know the financial position at the club and make a financial killing themselves if they can see an opportunity to do so - have more or less kept their hands in their pockets.

Who then from outside the club will stump up a reported £30 million to buy it, a reported extra £10 million a year to meet the current operational debt and a further say for arguments sake £10 million to invest in improving the playing staff in the January window (transfer fees and/or wages)?

That's £50 million invested more or less from day one, with NO return whatsoever and the investment!

What is the strategy to make money out of Bolton?

Clearly crowd attendance and shirt sales aren't making enough to keep the club afloat.

Neither is all this bollocks of investing in youth - how many home grown kids from any club actually make it?  How many of them that do get sold on for enough to cover the cost of running the academy each year?  

You're going to be lucky for the much vaunted youth policy - that every club as well as us are doing - actually adds a positive income stream to the club.

The only viable way to get a £50 million plus investment back is by being promoted to the Premier and do a Burnley - go up, spend no money, get relegated and bank on being promoted again inside a season or two, ad infinitum.

Who in the right minds have £50 million plus to take on a punt that they can achieve this with Bolton?

There are far easier and significantly less risky ventures to invest £50 million in than putting it all on the Bolton gamble.

So why then are people expressing interest at Bolton?

The only logical thing that comes to my mind is to buy the club as low as it can, sell off the assets to recover their costs and turn a profit and sod off with their money leaving the club to die.

It wouldn't be a first time this as happened in football either.


What a negative Nelly.

Fat Sam loves this club and is going to lead us to the promised land. I'll remind you of your post when we win the Champions League in 2025.

gloswhite

gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
Guðni Bergsson

Sluffy, there's a great deal of common sense in what you say, far more than in a lot of speculation on here. However, having supported this club for over 52 years, I, and every other fan, can only hope that something good comes out of this, and our club doesn't disappear into the annals of history

FullofSprite


Nicolas Anelka
Nicolas Anelka

From someone who supposedly works inside the club


ED wants 20% of the new company. All Holdsworth and his team get is control of the footballing side. Stadium, Academy and training facilities will be held by ED.

Peter Ridsdale (remember him) will be the new chairman.

Could be bollocks, could be right - who knows - maybe someone else has heard the same thing

Guest


Guest

FullofSprite wrote:From someone who supposedly works inside the club


ED wants 20% of the new company. All Holdsworth and his team get is control of the footballing side. Stadium, Academy and training facilities will be held by ED.

Peter Ridsdale (remember him) will be the new chairman.

Could be bollocks, could be right - who knows - maybe someone else has heard the same thing

Bang goes the argument that things couldn't possibly get any worse.......

Boggersbelief

Boggersbelief
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

FullofSprite wrote:From someone who supposedly works inside the club


ED wants 20% of the new company. All Holdsworth and his team get is control of the footballing side. Stadium, Academy and training facilities will be held by ED.

Peter Ridsdale (remember him) will be the new chairman.

Could be bollocks, could be right - who knows - maybe someone else has heard the same thing

It's so shit it's probably true

Guest


Guest

FullofSprite wrote:From someone who supposedly works inside the club


ED wants 20% of the new company. All Holdsworth and his team get is control of the footballing side. Stadium, Academy and training facilities will be held by ED.

Peter Ridsdale (remember him) will be the new chairman.

Could be bollocks, could be right - who knows - maybe someone else has heard the same thing

What exactly would they be buying then? Hand over 30 million and the only thing they have to show for it is Gary Madine.

observer


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Barb Dwyer wrote:
FullofSprite wrote:From someone who supposedly works inside the club


ED wants 20% of the new company. All Holdsworth and his team get is control of the footballing side. Stadium, Academy and training facilities will be held by ED.

Peter Ridsdale (remember him) will be the new chairman.

Could be bollocks, could be right - who knows - maybe someone else has heard the same thing

What exactly would they be buying then? Hand over 30 million and the only thing they have to show for it is Gary Madine.
I believe Barb has nailed this one!  No wonder everyone has walked away. 
Would anyone pay 30 million for:

a.     A team that may be relegated from the second tier (no matter what they call it next year);

b.     A team with no assets on the field... no assets is not exactly correct...  I'm sure the players are worth a few quid;

c.     A deal which strips all of the tangible assets;

d.     A 20% ownership by a management team which claims to have lost 180 million quid.

I would be suspect of anyone who buys the team with all of this baggage.

We need an owner who sees the value of spending some quid to move up next season and fight for a spot in the first tier and who is not afraid of putting up 30 million + 10 million in losses and +10-20 million in players.  The pot at the end of the rainbow is big and with the right players, we could once again be on the rise.  But as Barb points out, this is a very bad deal as it is rumored to be.



Last edited by observer on Tue Nov 17 2015, 12:18; edited 1 time in total

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

What an appalling deal. I really hope this isn't true.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Just for fun, what about this as a scenario.

I've always said - and most people now seem to agree with me - that Davies simply did not have the kind of money which he has supposed to have invested in the club.

So it seems feasible that others who have been close to the club at onetime or another may have well made a personal investment into it too.

Maybe Allardyce and Brown have put money into the club anonymously via Moonshift - its almost certainly against the rules for active managers/players to have investments in other teams - conflict of interests and all that.

If Davies has pulled the plug on himself investing further, what then happens to the interests of people such as Allardyce and Brown?

Maybe, just maybe there is some sort of a deal for them to have the footballing side in lieu of their invested monies - with Davies retaining ownership of everything else - at least for now?

It would then make some sense out of why Dean Holdsworth has randomly appeared on the scene and got involved with this so called takeover, being known and presumably reasonably close to all those involved (Davies and Gartside as well as Allardyce and Brown).

It would also make some sense out of him quitting as manager at Brentwood, so as to have no active day to day role in football (although he still has some form of role still at Brentwood I believe?).

Allardyce, Brown and possibly others presumably can not be seen to be part of the 'takeover' whilst they are employed by other clubs and so the need for some sort of stalking horse company like the recently formed one that Holdsworth is involved in.

I assume Allardyce in particular would have built up a rapport with many wealthy people involved in football over the years - such as Gold and Sullivan at West Ham and Ashley at Newcastle (although he was sacked by him!) who know how to achieve what they want.

I don't think for one minute that Allardyce and Brown would want to get involved again with Bolton because they love the club (what bollocks some people believe in) but merely as a way of protecting their financial investment with the aim of getting their money back (and more if they can do so!).

I'm just playing but stranger things have happened I guess!



wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Isn't it weird that the club suddenly learn how to drive a hard bargain after years and years of overpaying for players and selling them on too cheaply?

Numpty 28723

Numpty 28723
Andy Walker
Andy Walker

wanderlust wrote:Isn't it weird that the club suddenly learn how to drive a hard bargain after years and years of overpaying for players and selling them on too cheaply?

A good point.

And it begs the question of how some supposedly successful businessmen became wealthy in the first place.

(Even with my limited knowledge I could have saved them £8.2 million on Elmander alone by telling them how shit he was after watching him play in the Euros just a few months before we signed him).

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

I thought I remembered a connection between Peter Risdale and Deano but the only place I could find in which they were mentioned in the same breath is here:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't think that's quite enough to add any credibility to the rumour though.

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