In war, does anything go?

Look at this, a "farmer" blown to bits by an american chopper is mockingly serenaded by his executioner.

Bit sick isn't it, but in a war does morality go out window?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2169418/US-helicopter-strike-blasts-Afghan-man-pilot-sings-Bye-bye-Miss-American-Pie.html

In the wider sense, no, I don't think 'anything goes' at time of war.

However I'm not particularly disgusted by the video because the context is not known. The victim could be a suicide bomber on his way to blowing up civilians. We just don't know.

It did remind me of the scene in Full Metal Jacket where the nutcase is shooting random people out of the helicopter though.

A lot of soldiers become desensitized at some of the things they have witnessed in conflict. Making a joke of a tragedy is a way of letting off steam.

Like LH says for all we know they were not farmers but members of the Taliban. The American Troops don't make a habit of blowing farmers up for no good reason. It's not good for morale.

If anyone is interested in stuff like this then I strongly recommend you read a book by Jim Frederick, called 'Black Hearts'.

It tells the true story of a platoon of American soldiers in Iraq in 2005 who see their mates blown to pieces, captured and beheaded, extremely poor leadership culture from above and how a group of them ended up committing an atrocity.

I picked the book up for £2.99 at one of those high street cheap book chains (sorry can't think of their name) - for that price I thought I could chuck it away if I could not get into it - and found that it was the best book I've read in ages.

Yes.

No, it doesn't. Circumstances may change, but the basic tenet of protecting the innocent should never be violated, reagardless of which 'side' they belong to. Anyone who is involved, in whatever way, is fair game, but should still be handled in proportion to what they have done. 'Minimum force' is more of an ideal than a reality, but should still be adhered to whenever possible. Over-reactions to situations should always be taken in context, and that includes both mental and physical considerations.

The soldier has found that removing the humanity from the situation makes it easier to deal with. Understandable, in my view. I don't think 'anything goes', however.

Angry Dad wrote:Yes.

indeed

We are not at war.What happened in Iraq and now in Afghanistan is totally unacceptable. Tens of thousands (although we will never know how many) of innocent civilians killed, mainly by the Americans. They did the same in Vietnam (what the hell were they doing in Vietnam). They couldn't match the north Vietnamese fighting them in the jungle so resorted to mass carpet bombing resulting again in thousands of innocent civilians losing their lives. The Americans with their stupid love of guns have brought us to were we are now but will never be brought to account.

yesbutno wrote:We are not at war.What happened in Iraq and now in Afghanistan is totally unacceptable. Tens of thousands (although we will never know how many) of innocent civilians killed, mainly by the Americans. They did the same in Vietnam (what the hell were they doing in Vietnam). They couldn't match the north Vietnamese fighting them in the jungle so resorted to mass carpet bombing resulting again in thousands of innocent civilians losing their lives. The Americans with their stupid love of guns have brought us to were we are now but will never be brought to account.

they were fighting communism, which is most noble

So you think communism is noble?

I don't think it's noble but must admit it has its good points.

I'm with YEsbut on this. Not only did the Yanks bomb the crap out of Vietnam, and Iraq but think it's ok to wipe-out villages in Pakistan. But that's ok because the whole world (apart from those mussers) just loves us. Go on you Englanders admit it. Don't you really wish you were American.

yesbutno wrote:So you think communism is noble?

I don't think it's noble but must admit it has its good points.

No i think if you read it again he means its noble to fight communism.

Why is it noble to fight someone who has a different view than yourself on the way the cake should be shared out.

The problem with Vietnam was that the Americans were fighting an ideal, and could not differentiate who was ally and who was enemy. Because of this they resorted to the 'American way', which as we saw didn't work, and certainly caused more deaths and misery that such an approach demanded. Unhfortunately, their view of the world doesn't seem to have changed, nor their role in it.

No the problem with Vietnam was not that they couldn't differentiate but that they have this massive sense of entitlement and don't care how many die. We are the best god damn country in the world and we know what's best for you. (Don't forget we can always 'nuke' you)

You're right in that they have no concept of how to deal with other countries, and how they see themselves. Read something the other day, where they are beginning to wonder just where they are, (especially with Obama's shambolic foreign policies), and are beginning to get very nervous with the financial and military power of China. When you add to that the Soviet threat is beginning to rise again, then its a bit worrying if they (the Americans) try their 'We know best' approach to things.

Iran will be a problem. We mustn't tell the Americans that we will support them. They will find it harder to take the military option if they are on their own. Not for troop numbers but world opinion.

Anyway huge new oil (shale) reserves have been found in the US and with the high price making exploration more attractive their Middle East adventures may be less important to them.

CB, you're right, being a more established democracy, etc, we are often taken along for the vote rather than any material support. I agree with the comment about the shale oil, but the down side is that when you get idiots like Ahmadinejad, to leave them alone coulds be extremely dangerous. It would seem liket we need the Americans to push the indecisive UN to actually doing something, but without their gung-ho attitude.

I never really knew anything about Vietnam so I read a bit last night - I had no idea how long it went on for. Yonks. And yonks.

You see a lot of films about the war and it seems to always portray Americans as "goodies" who save the day. Very propaganda-ry.