The rise and rise of UKIP...

One question mark and exclamation mark will suffice. 

We had an 0.1 percent growth before the coalition the kind of growth that has been roundly mocked by Labour when pointed too by the tories of progress. 

you also have to consider the external pressures of both governments a worldwide crash and a eurozone crisis. Fact of the matter is whoever came in would have had to cut the shit out of the country because Labour pissed the money up the wall on illegal wars and catastrophic mismanagement of the banks.

You're free to believe Labour would have had the economy and deficit singing and dancing again but history tells us it's bollocks, Labour readily fuck up the economy, the tories come in and fix it for Labour to sling it down the tube again and rinse repeat. 

The Labour party are a frigging joke.

Let not forget that the worldwide crash happened in 2008 and NOT 2010.  Labour had to bail ut the RBS group or otherwise more than 60% of the population would have lost their savings, along with the Royalty, because of the banks that the RBS group owned - any other political party, in power, would have done the same.

Illegal wars are one thing which is what Blair did and not part of Labours manifesto for the last 2 to 3 years of their term, when Gordon Brown was leader.  Like BWFC1874 said, why were revisions of the countrys growth actually revised upwards, and not downwards, if Labours so-called mismanagement were that catastrophic, whilst under the Tories it has been constantly revised downwards!

Hipster_Nebula wrote:I'm about as far away from a Tory as you could ever be, but to suggest the this government has damaged the economy more than Labour I simply don't agree with, even if you consider some of Labour's problems were not self made.

I hate Cameron and 99% of what he stands for but if you're giving me a choice of him and Osbourne vs Ed Miliband and Ed Balls I'm taking Cameron 10/10. 

Labour are absolutely bereft of genuinely inspiring and intelligent thinkers or remotely talented politicians sadly, the party went to shit when James Purnell jumped and David Miliband didn't back him up. 

Ed Balls is an absolute clown and Milliband isn't far behind.

My point isn't that the Labour party did less damage to the economy, more that the 'success' of the Tories recovery plan is being massively overplayed by them and people are falling for it. 

I've not decided who I'll vote for but I'm sick of hearing the same line about the Torie's 'long-term economic plan' - which has only benefited a small portion of the population, if they win another election the wealth gap will only increase.

bwfc71 wrote:Let not forget that the worldwide crash happened in 2008 and NOT 2010.  Labour had to bail ut the RBS group or otherwise more than 60% of the population would have lost their savings, along with the Royalty, because of the banks that the RBS group owned - any other political party, in power, would have done the same.

Illegal wars are one thing which is what Blair did and not part of Labours manifesto for the last 2 to 3 years of their term, when Gordon Brown was leader.  Like BWFC1874 said, why were revisions of the countrys growth actually revised upwards, and not downwards, if Labours so-called mismanagement were that catastrophic, whilst under the Tories it has been constantly revised downwards!

I know the crash was in 2008, the Eurozone crisis started in 09 and struck heavily at the start of this government which added pressures to the economy, the whole thing is just without context think of all the crisis' that have happened that effect trading during the course of this government. And I'm not suggesting the tories have done a good job btw I'm simply arguing that they haven't done anything like the kind of wanton damage Labour did. 

The wars were a hangover considering we were still heavily involved until THIS YEAR and are still paying the price in Iraq. 

the rest of the stuff is completely without context it's alright getting a measly 0.1% growth but forgetting the massive drops you had before hand.

The growth of the super-rich is down to Labour politicians as well as the Tories as this documentary clearly shows and they have no plans to do anything about it. Even if we get a mansion tax it will be a drop in the ocean to the super-rich parasites.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCcQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.co.uk%2Fprogrammes%2Fb04xw4rw&ei=wM-3VPmyMIWvUYrEgvgL&usg=AFQjCNGC3VKFKrS0EHx7G4WFCI_LeHXg8Q&sig2=yJV85zfmhkUT1Nyiwu4DDg

The superrich don't concern me. Like Islam, Unions, War, Immigration, bankers and other sensationalist red herrings that make good column inches but have relatively little effect on the economy they only serve to distract ordinary people from the real (albeit relatively boring) issues.

I hate it when people are manipulated into voting one way or other by the media who like to play to (and build up) people's prejuduces.

We want to win and feel smug about the end of perceived injustices or the demise of people we don't like or are jealous of and the media play on it.

For example:Thatcher played on people's fear of "the power of the unions" and a lot of people were smug after the Unions were defeated - a strategy that neatly diverted attention away from her cowboy economics that sold off the country's assets to pay for her excesses in Argentina (and we call Blair's war dodgy?! The Falklands was ridiculous) and in the economy. She succeeded in positioning the Unions - formerly the saviour of the working class - as enemies of the state rather than protectors of the poor - thanks to Saatchi's and the media she controlled.

It's just an example of how "opinion" is controlled for political gain.

Today, the media keep throwing up stories that appeal because they appal.

But what story could possibly compare with the current Government taking on unprecedented crippling debt that will hamstring the country for generations to come?

If the bankers bonuses were capped, immigration halved and benefits to immigrants stopped completely the economic impact would be insignificantly miniscule compared to the impact of the borrowing this Government is doing to hide their incompetence/unwillingness to introduce austerity as it may cost votes.

But are we talking about it? Is rocketing national debt the main headline in the papers every day?

Of course not because it's real and it's boring and the media are too busy playing on the prejudices of the ignorant. If the Government want to hide our escalating debt and the financial losses of "UK PLC" what better way to do it than to fill the media with fear of paedophiles or devolution or Romanian immigrants?

Don't get fooled again.

I know UKIP voters are desperate to feel smug about "sending the mainstream parties a message" because they've been suckered in again and haven't bothered or can't understand the economic implications for them. It's a cheap psychological trick that appeals to the "need to feel smug" aspects of personality.
Well the mainstream parties have got the message so they should back off before they do some damage that nobody can repair.

The irony is that the anarchists are very anti-UKIP - yet UKIP is probably more likely to bring anarchy than revolution.

WL I think you really should have a look at the programme about the super-rich and then you might be a bit more concerned about them.

This isn't about envy this is about the real damage they are doing to our economy and governments have encouraged it because they believe the vicious con that is called the trickle down effect. This is the fantasy that billionaires spending money on servants and luxury goods benefits the rest of us. The simple truth is it doesn't. Wealth actually trickles up not down. The richest 1% and even more the richest 0.1% have got massively richer over the last 30 years while the rest of us have got nothing. The share of the country's wealth owned by the richest 1% has tripled in the last 30 years.

Christ Almighty! Just witnessed Green party leader Natalie Bennett getting savaged on the Sunday Politics Show by Andrew Neil. Absolutely embarrassing.

I know it will never happen (thank God) but if they ever got in power we'd be ripe for invasion and there would be a terrorist attack on a daily basis.

I can't imagine the leader of the Monster Raving Loony party coming across any worse.

i take it she's not ready to take part in the election debates on tv then? Not always an accurate picture though, i remember Clegg came across really well last time and look at him now.

Natasha Whittam wrote:Christ Almighty! Just witnessed Green party leader Natalie Bennett getting savaged on the Sunday Politics Show by Andrew Neil. Absolutely embarrassing.

I know it will never happen (thank God) but if they ever got in power we'd be ripe for invasion and there would be a terrorist attack on a daily basis.

I can't imagine the leader of the Monster Raving Loony party coming across any worse.

I saw the interview and she was useless - it was like as though she didn't even try to prepare for the interview.  Andrew Neill just asked the normal questions about the Greens polices and she had very little knowledge and just kept referring back to the Greens website.  Definitely not a contender for PM thank goodness!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukip-senior-official-matthew-richardson-says-bigots-deserve-representation-and-calls-nhs-the-biggest-waste-of-money-in-the-uk-10000981.html

At last, somebody to look after my bigotted interests!!
I'll give them a miss on the NHS comments!!

Soul Kitchen wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukip-senior-official-matthew-richardson-says-bigots-deserve-representation-and-calls-nhs-the-biggest-waste-of-money-in-the-uk-10000981.html

At last, somebody to look after my bigotted interests!!
I'll give them a miss on the NHS comments!!

You're spoilt for choice with the EDL and Britain First, plenty of fascists to look after you.

When UKIP get in i think they will really sort this country out for the better, im sick of the tennis game between Labour and the Tories, we need a new game of Judo and they are going to throw all the illegal immigrants out and fuck Europe off, i'm really excited about them coming into power, there are going to be clubs called the UKIP clubs round the country 1.50 a pint.

bwfc1874 wrote:

Soul Kitchen wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukip-senior-official-matthew-richardson-says-bigots-deserve-representation-and-calls-nhs-the-biggest-waste-of-money-in-the-uk-10000981.html

At last, somebody to look after my bigotted interests!!
I'll give them a miss on the NHS comments!!

You're spoilt for choice with the EDL and Britain First, plenty of fascists to look after you.

Yeh, true. And the looney party for you drug addicts!!

I've said it before,and I'll say it again,UKIP will devour itself from within. You can see the beginnings of it now.
It's all smoke and mirrors. They'll probably last about as long as the SDP.

Soul Kitchen wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:

Soul Kitchen wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukip-senior-official-matthew-richardson-says-bigots-deserve-representation-and-calls-nhs-the-biggest-waste-of-money-in-the-uk-10000981.html

At last, somebody to look after my bigotted interests!!
I'll give them a miss on the NHS comments!!

You're spoilt for choice with the EDL and Britain First, plenty of fascists to look after you.

Yeh, true. And the looney party for you drug addicts!!

Green party would be better for cannabis smokers in fairness.

boltonbonce wrote:I've said it before,and I'll say it again,UKIP will devour itself from within. You can see the beginnings of it now.
It's all smoke and mirrors. They'll probably last about as long as the SDP.

Completely agree with you Bonce, as they get more attention and are being taken more seriously their lack of policies are coming under scrutiny. A poor performance in the general election and I think Nigel will be fading into obscurity.

Thankfully there's another choice.

I mentioned when Nat was banging the kipper drum 12 months ago about the depth of their policies other than immigration, it's there for all to see. They are actually more right wing than Thatcher's lot!!!!

I've already bought my Lidl starter kilt.