Well then..........

Honestly, believe me when I say that I take no pleasure in saying that "I told you so" regarding our current plight.

It was obvious that we'd struggle this season when we passed on ALF and decided to go with Madine and the procession of free signings, "pay as you play deals" and other dross that we now call our first team squad.

They are poor.

And the manager isn't up to much either.

(Called that too.)

Despite what certain posters may say, I am not Bolton Hater.

I am "Bolton Fan Of 35 Years Who Is Getting Fed Up With The Eddie Davies & Phil Gartside Self-Serving Show Which is Fucking Our Club Up And Means That There Is A Very Real Chance That There Won't Be A BWFC Soon Club" and I've had enough.

We are going to get relegated to League One.

Because the people in charge have either given up, died a while ago or are only interested in serving their own ends.

Yes, Phil - I'm looking at you.

So, amidst this perfect storm of football shit, where do we go?

"Fuck knows" is the simple answer.

I was there in the 80's when we nearly went bust and stopped being a football club - For the younger contributors out there, we were within 2 weeks of the club folding because we couldn't pay the bills.

(Not the Chairman's wage - the water rates.)

Boom! No more BWFC.

Imagine that.....

But we founded the Lifeline and rescued the club.

Could we do that nowadays?

No - Could we bollocks. Because back then it was simple - We need X amount for this and Y amount for that - and we all pitched in and stumped up.

The debt wasn't hidden in financial reports lodged at Companies House, mired in language we didn't understand - it was out there and the appeal was genuine.

And we had a chairman who was honestly interested in keeping the club afloat.

Unlike now.

The Fourth Division bottom-out that served as a wake-up call in the 80's is long gone.

We won't make it to League Two (Fourth Division in old money) because we will go bust before we get there.

FC Wanderers of Bolton.

It's looking increasingly more like a reality with every passing game.

Wonder if Chorley will let us ground share......?

Not much can be said about that really. Certainly can't argue with any of it. It was a bit before my time when we almost went bust in the 80's. It's still hard to believe where we've ended up. My optimism has gradually eroded away to the point where I honestly believe we will get relegated. I don't know the exact figure off the top of my head but we must be up to about 1 win in 24 or summat daft like that. I really believed Lennon could push us on this year, despite having no money. I thought he could at least coach some results out of the shit players we have even if he couldn't buy results in the form of new players. How very wrong I was. It doesn't get any more grim than this. We are well and truly fucked.

All valid points Breadman, I live in South Africa so don't hear local radio, I check out the Bolton news everyday but Gartside doesn't appear to have issued any statements of concern or given the dreaded backing to the manager. Has he said anything at all regarding our plight?

I think that the Eddie is not going to spend another penny on this club, imagine that.

That new player we got on loan, City are paying his full wages, we're that skint now, with a shit team that we have no other option than to go down, and when we do it'll be the same old shit.

Well I hope 'saint fucking Eddie' is pleased with the position we are now in because its down soley to his decision to keep that leech Gartside in as his chairman for the time of his tenure. He should have been fired when they took the absolutely shite decision to appointment Sammy Lee as Manager. the typical petty 'cheap Bolton Option' as always, and don't give me that continuity argument shite, because that's what started the rot after Ian Greaves left and look what happened then. When Sam Allardyce left we were in the position of being a very attractive club for a proven manager to take over, upper half of the prem and qualifying for Europe, but did he advertise it? - did he fuck - and that's when the downward spiral started, he appointed S L who had never managed and quite obviously couldn't, and we are where we are now because after he predictably failed. Gartside who "knew football" had to appoint what he regarded as a firefighter - the fact he was a twat of a man, a manager who had ruined perfectly well run clubs previously and played shite football meant nothing to him because Gartside has never admitted to a fuck up in his life - League cup final tickets fiasco anyone? Anyone who has made so many diabolical professional decisions (two tier premiership with no relegation?? he knew what was coming along time ago and turned him and us into a laughing stock) would have been fucked out of their position long ago but not with good old Eddie in charge. saviour of BWFC - don't make me laugh - anyone owns the club but refuses to see the cancer at the club, who is just a self serving £600K+ megalomaniac, and remove him deserves to lose every penny they put in. Ask yourself if you were in charge and a 'massive lifelong fan' and you could see you were going to destroy the club would you keep digging the hole?? I wouldn't.  Right now FC Wanderers of Bolton - not fuckin horwich! - can't come quickly enough.

Alf Hooker wrote:He should have been fired when they took the absolutely shite decision to appointment Sammy Lee as Manager. the typical petty 'cheap Bolton Option' as always, and don't give me that continuity argument shite

I think continuity is the last thing anyone could argue. The playing style and methods were changed so drastically in such a short space of time it was never going to work. Every decision since big sam walked out of the door regarding managers has been wrong, with each manager having a more difficult job than the last. If Lennon did leave I dread to think who fuck up Phil would appoint next. Someone like Lee Clark would be a prime candidate I would think.

Bwfc1958 wrote:

Alf Hooker wrote:He should have been fired when they took the absolutely shite decision to appointment Sammy Lee as Manager. the typical petty 'cheap Bolton Option' as always, and don't give me that continuity argument shite

I think continuity is the last thing anyone could argue. The playing style and methods were changed so drastically in such a short space of time it was never going to work. Every decision since big sam walked out of the door regarding managers has been wrong, with each manager having a more difficult job than the last. If Lennon did leave I dread to think who fuck up Phil would appoint next. Someone like Lee Clark would be a prime candidate I would think.

I didn't mean in the style of play - I meant promoting the assistant to be the manager - this tactic has always backfired -George Mullhall et al - Colin Todd had to have his hand held after Bruce left - and he lasted until guess who? sold Per Frandesn from under him.

Alf Hooker wrote:Well I hope 'saint fucking Eddie' is pleased with the position we are now in because its down soley to his decision to keep that leech Gartside in as his chairman for the time of his tenure. He should have been fired when they took the absolutely shite decision to appointment Sammy Lee as Manager. the typical petty 'cheap Bolton Option' as always, and don't give me that continuity argument shite,

I'm no fan of Gartside but to blame him is ridiculous.

Sammy Lee was the obvious choice as he'd been Fat Sam's assistant for a long time. He knew the club and he knew the players. He tried to change the style of football too quickly and that was his downfall. Having said that, he only got 9 games - both Freedman and Lennon have been on worse runs - and who is to say that given time Lee couldn't have made it work. I'd wager a bet that if the club had stuck with Lee we wouldn't be as poor as we are now.

Megson was a poor choice, fair enough, he should have been potted long before he was.

But Owen Coyle was again the obvious choice. He did well in Scotland and got Burnley into the Premier League. And with his strong connection to Bolton he was the fans choice. No one was moaning when he was appointed manager. And for a time things were ace under Coyle, when Stuart Holden was on fire. And he got us to an FA Cup Semi Final. Yes, it ended up being a disaster, but as I've said, no one was moaning when he was appointed.

But the most important fact is that Gartside almost certainly does nothing without Eddie Davies giving the go ahead. Davies runs this football club, Gartside is just the front man.

Yes it's Eddie who refuses to spend anymore money, the quicker we are sold the better.

Sammy Lee was the cheap choice, not the obvious one.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

Alf Hooker wrote:Well I hope 'saint fucking Eddie' is pleased with the position we are now in because its down soley to his decision to keep that leech Gartside in as his chairman for the time of his tenure. He should have been fired when they took the absolutely shite decision to appointment Sammy Lee as Manager. the typical petty 'cheap Bolton Option' as always, and don't give me that continuity argument shite,

I'm no fan of Gartside but to blame him is ridiculous.

Sammy Lee was the obvious choice as he'd been Fat Sam's assistant for a long time. He knew the club and he knew the players. He tried to change the style of football too quickly and that was his downfall. Having said that, he only got 9 games - both Freedman and Lennon have been on worse runs - and who is to say that given time Lee couldn't have made it work. I'd wager a bet that if the club had stuck with Lee we wouldn't be as poor as we are now.

Megson was a poor choice, fair enough, he should have been potted long before he was.

But Owen Coyle was again the obvious choice. He did well in Scotland and got Burnley into the Premier League. And with his strong connection to Bolton he was the fans choice. No one was moaning when he was appointed manager. And for a time things were ace under Coyle, when Stuart Holden was on fire. And he got us to an FA Cup Semi Final. Yes, it ended up being a disaster, but as I've said, no one was moaning when he was appointed.

But the most important fact is that Gartside almost certainly does nothing without Eddie Davies giving the go ahead. Davies runs this football club, Gartside is just the front man.

Sorry Nat you're wrong on this one - Sammy lee was the WORST choice out there and me an those sat around me knew it, but we also knew it would happen - He was not and never will be a manager - just look how many good assistants can't hack it as managers - and as it happens the appointment of Coyle wasn't met with universal approval either - plenty of us thought he was too inexperienced, got lucky for 12months at Burnley, got found out and made too many major fuckups to sort out the shit that was the Good ship BWFC he steadied it for a bit. but again when he was found to be taking us down Gartside didn't pull the trigger till 12 months too late, and what the fuck was the Freedman appointment?? I still don't get that one. Between them Gartside and Davies have fucked us royally - and I still blame that twat Gartside for me having to buy a ticket for the league cup final on the black market.

bwfc1874 wrote:Sammy Lee was the cheap choice, not the obvious one.

He was the bookies favourite.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:Sammy Lee was the cheap choice, not the obvious one.

He was the bookies favourite.

and....

Seems pointless rehashing conversations about Gartside and previous managers unless you need someone to blame or just want a good moan rather than find solutions to our current plight. We can't change our previous managers and it's unlikely anything will change as regards Gartside's position for now. Plus the club are trying to find a new owner so there really is nothing to be gained going over this for the thousandth time.

What could change is the manager, player's attitude, communications from the club and the style of play - in the absence of money, surely these are the important things?

...........But the most important fact is that Gartside almost certainly does nothing without Eddie Davies giving the go ahead. Davies runs this football club, Gartside is just the front man.

Does Eddie Davies still attend matches and is he well, I heard a rumour he had dementia? The last time I saw him on TV he looked distinctly unwell!

Never thought I'd say this,but I'm beginning to envy Leeds Utd.

Being sold now is the only hope.  You can't coach poor players to be good ones...that's all there is to it.

Needless to say the Bristol City game is a six pointer.

I still think we will escape by one or two positions....only because the likes of Preston etc....are worse than us over the course of the season.  Although I wouldn't bet my mortgage on it.

Maybe in the next window somat will be done to just help us squeak by.....again I'm not betting money on that one either.

Realistically though, who on earth is going to come in and invest in Bolton?

Nobody really makes money out of owning a football club unless it's got global brand appeal and that's something we're a bit short on.

Or of course you can make money (on paper at least) by pocketing most of the revenue and inflating the value of the club's property assets and using it to write off tax liability as you sit in your mansion on the Isle of Man but that's old hat because it's already been done.

So we're stuck with what we've got because if we were a decent proposition, we'd have already been snapped up.

And that means no more investment from our current owners.

So we're heading one way - down.

And we'll be in this same mess next season, but in League One with even less cash from Sky.

We really are screwed and I can't see a way out.

wanderlust wrote:Seems pointless rehashing conversations about Gartside and previous managers unless you need someone to blame or just want a good moan rather than find solutions to our current plight.

You don't understand forums do you.

Alf Hooker mentions what happened after Ian Greaves left and asks don't give him the continuity argument crap of promoting assistants. Just to put the record right after Jimmy Armfield left for Leeds his assistant was appointed as our manager with continuity probably in mind.........Ian Greaves!

Just saying