We can still stay up - and will.

MartinBWFC wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Are you for real?

We had the same conversation last week too - and I'm not the only one who thinks you're talking out your arse.

You're being blinded by one great performance, you slag Coyle off, but heap praise on a piss poor manager, you just don't know very much about football if you think Parkinson deserves anything other than the sack.

What the fuck are you talking about, I've been praising Parkinson's managerial achievements - under the enormous barriers that have been placed in his way for the last TWO SEASON's - not just because of the latest game!

As for Coyle he bought Sordell for £3 million (who went on to make to substitute appearances that season) when even a blind man could see we desperately need a midfield replacement for Stuart Holding to stay up!

As for the utter shite he lumbered us with on massive wages and long contracts - Christ he even resigned Zat Knight on a further TWO YEARS contract!!!

I don't think anyone (other than you perhaps) would think Coyle a better manager than Parkinson - free's and loan players to build a team from, under embargos for a season and a half, key player sold and not replaced halfway through the season, etc, etc.

Parkinson's certainly not perfect but Coyle (Wigan, Houston, Blackburn, Ross County) is just a joke.

Sluffy wrote:
Anderson deserves praise for us even still having a club to support - yet moonmen like Wanderlust believe he's robbing the club blind 

Wrong again. If you bothered to read what I write you'd see that I have consistently pointed out that Anderson has a history of defrauding companies and therefore I don't trust him and only time will tell what he is doing as we simply don't know as yet. Until that day comes, there really is nothing else to say about the matter.

We now need investment, and we need someone who can pick players who actually want to play for the club!  Not an easy task but one that is necessary for us to get to mid-table.

Sluffy wrote:

MartinBWFC wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Are you for real?

We had the same conversation last week too - and I'm not the only one who thinks you're talking out your arse.

You're being blinded by one great performance, you slag Coyle off, but heap praise on a piss poor manager, you just don't know very much about football if you think Parkinson deserves anything other than the sack.

What the fuck are you talking about, I've been praising Parkinson's managerial achievements - under the enormous barriers that have been placed in his way for the last TWO SEASON's - not just because of the latest game!

As for Coyle he bought Sordell for £3 million (who went on to make to substitute appearances that season) when even a blind man could see we desperately need a midfield replacement for Stuart Holden to stay up!

As for the utter shite he lumbered us with on massive wages and long contracts - Christ he even resigned Zat Knight on a further TWO YEARS contract!!!

I don't think anyone (other than you perhaps) would think Coyle a better manager than Parkinson - free's and loan players to build a team from, under embargos for a season and a half, key player sold and not replaced halfway through the season, etc, etc.

Parkinson's certainly not perfect but Coyle (Wigan, Houston, Blackburn, Ross County) is just a joke.

As for not knowing much about football, well that may well be true - but by God that would mean you know next to nothing then as at least I know the three worst teams get relegated, that we wouldn't get relegated and the Parkinson (whether you like it or not) as done a wonderful job keeping us up.

wanderlust wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Anderson deserves praise for us even still having a club to support - yet moonmen like Wanderlust believe he's robbing the club blind 

Wrong again. If you bothered to read what I write you'd see that I have consistently pointed out that Anderson has a history of defrauding companies and therefore I don't trust him and only time will tell what he is doing as we simply don't know as yet. Until that day comes, there really is nothing else to say about the matter.

Christ you're still banging on the club paid for Holdsworth shares from the liquidator - so yes, against my own better sense I do read your myopic posts about Anderson, shake my head and attempt to set you straight.

Obviously wasting my time - but better than letting unsubstantiated anti Anderson hatred pollute the forum.

Sluffy wrote:

MartinBWFC wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Are you for real?

We had the same conversation last week too - and I'm not the only one who thinks you're talking out your arse.

You're being blinded by one great performance, you slag Coyle off, but heap praise on a piss poor manager, you just don't know very much about football if you think Parkinson deserves anything other than the sack.

What the fuck are you talking about, I've been praising Parkinson's managerial achievements - under the enormous barriers that have been placed in his way for the last TWO SEASON's - not just because of the latest game!

As for Coyle he bought Sordell for £3 million (who went on to make to substitute appearances that season) when even a blind man could see we desperately need a midfield replacement for Stuart Holding to stay up!

As for the utter shite he lumbered us with on massive wages and long contracts - Christ he even resigned Zat Knight on a further TWO YEARS contract!!!

I don't think anyone (other than you perhaps) would think Coyle a better manager than Parkinson - free's and loan players to build a team from, under embargos for a season and a half, key player sold and not replaced halfway through the season, etc, etc.

Parkinson's certainly not perfect but Coyle (Wigan, Houston, Blackburn, Ross County) is just a joke.

We got Coyle after the good things he did at Burnley, and of course, people remember the things he did as a player with us. He was doing fine until the Stoke game in the FA Cup semis. After that it went down hill rapidly. The problem is we had very average players on big wages. Parkinson has done well considering the lack of investment, but history shows that he is clueless at this level. There is no plan B. He was basically told by Ken to play an attacking line up today. If Ken had said nothing do you think we would have been looking at the same line up and result ? Personally, I doubt it. Great win today, but it should be expected to beat a team that are already planning their holidays. Look at Wolves, hammered by Sunderland today. We got dicked 4-0 by Wolves, so how come a team below us can get that kind of result ? For me today, Parky had nothing to do with the win. He's a nice guy, but if the players can't give 100% for him it's time for a complete overhaul.

Little is the driving force in this team. Yes, he's far from a good defender, but his runs give the whole team impetus. Before his sending off at QPR he was up there for player of the season, but since then Parky has hardly used him, instead giving Flanagan the right back spot. Crazy.

Ameobi. He hasn't played well for ages. Today he looked knackered after 10 minutes and gave the ball away more than anyone else. He should have been subbed instead of Morais, all our danger was coming from the right thanks to the Little/Morais combination.

It's mental decisions like this, and the chopping and changing every week, that have cost us too many points. As Dunkels King says, would Bolton have been on the front foot so much today if Ken hadn't stepped in? It's unlikely.

And if there's a bit of money to spend this Summer would you really want Parky spending it? How many of his signings this season have come good?

Sluffy is entitled to his opinion that Parky has done well, but I disagree, I think this has been done despite Parky and not because of him. Too many times I've left the ground scratching my head at the tactics or personnel. If Parky is still manager I fully expect to be in the bottom 3 next season, because it'll be more of the same sadly.

Sluffy wrote:

wanderlust wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Anderson deserves praise for us even still having a club to support - yet moonmen like Wanderlust believe he's robbing the club blind 

Wrong again. If you bothered to read what I write you'd see that I have consistently pointed out that Anderson has a history of defrauding companies and therefore I don't trust him and only time will tell what he is doing as we simply don't know as yet. Until that day comes, there really is nothing else to say about the matter.

Christ you're still banging on the club paid for Holdsworth shares from the liquidator - so yes, against my own better sense I do read your myopic posts about Anderson, shake my head and attempt to set you straight.

Obviously wasting my time - but better than letting unsubstantiated anti Anderson hatred pollute the forum.

I don't hate him at all. I just don't trust him.

Natasha Whittam wrote:Little is the driving force in this team. Yes, he's far from a good defender, but his runs give the whole team impetus. Before his sending off at QPR he was up there for player of the season, but since then Parky has hardly used him, instead giving Flanagan the right back spot. Crazy.

Ameobi. He hasn't played well for ages. Today he looked knackered after 10 minutes and gave the ball away more than anyone else. He should have been subbed instead of Morais, all our danger was coming from the right thanks to the Little/Morais combination.

It's mental decisions like this, and the chopping and changing every week, that have cost us too many points. As Dunkels King says, would Bolton have been on the front foot so much today if Ken hadn't stepped in? It's unlikely.

And if there's a bit of money to spend this Summer would you really want Parky spending it? How many of his signings this season have come good?

Sluffy is entitled to his opinion that Parky has done well, but I disagree, I think this has been done despite Parky and not because of him. Too many times I've left the ground scratching my head at the tactics or personnel. If Parky is still manager I fully expect to be in the bottom 3 next season, because it'll be more of the same sadly.

Perfectly put Nat, as you said in another post, I cannot see the championship being this bad again, and we'll see Parkinson in his true light, even Wigan and Blackburn will better our results next season if Parkinson is allowed to carry on, and god forbid he has money to spend.

I like Little too, but he can be a liability and was totally mugged for Forest's second today. 
Fortunately it really doesn't matter now.

Natasha Whittam wrote:Little is the driving force in this team. Yes, he's far from a good defender, but his runs give the whole team impetus. Before his sending off at QPR he was up there for player of the season, but since then Parky has hardly used him, instead giving Flanagan the right back spot. Crazy.

Ameobi. He hasn't played well for ages. Today he looked knackered after 10 minutes and gave the ball away more than anyone else. He should have been subbed instead of Morais, all our danger was coming from the right thanks to the Little/Morais combination.

It's mental decisions like this, and the chopping and changing every week, that have cost us too many points. As Dunkels King says, would Bolton have been on the front foot so much today if Ken hadn't stepped in? It's unlikely.

And if there's a bit of money to spend this Summer would you really want Parky spending it? How many of his signings this season have come good?

Sluffy is entitled to his opinion that Parky has done well, but I disagree, I think this has been done despite Parky and not because of him. Too many times I've left the ground scratching my head at the tactics or personnel. If Parky is still manager I fully expect to be in the bottom 3 next season, because it'll be more of the same sadly.

All fair comment but I don't think things are as black and white as you make out.

I strongly suspect that there have been things going on behind the scenes that have effected players availability - maybe bonus payments triggered after a set number of games, or player loans only being granted on them having a guarantee of a set minimum number of first team games.

I also doubt very strongly that Parkinson has much of a say about what players are brought in or sold - his job is more about getting the best from what he has been given.

This could explain why Little simply disappeared and Flanagan played in his place (if there was a contract condition of first team play), or why the centre back pairing seemed to change for every match towards the end of the season (if bonus payment triggers were approaching), etc.

I also doubt very much that Anderson told Parkinson what team to play - otherwise I'm sure Alf would have started and not Wilbraham for instance.  If Anderson really was picking the team he would have been doing so a long time before todays game.

Anderson will again be the one bringing in the players next season and I suspect and much better balanced side will be in place rather than the half cocked one we had when the new embargo seemed to stop us getting Spearing back as a defensive midfielder and made us play our first 9 games (20% of the season) without us even having one of them in our squad!

The playing squad we had (rightly or wrongly) dictated that we HAD to play to a target man - when Madine left we were somewhat knackered - and really had no option but to continue to play the way we had (we were a top half team based on results from game 12 to when Madine left) without a cutting edge anymore.

I can't see such inflexibility being forced upon the team with so many new players required to fill out the squad and hopefully better quality centre backs will help reduce the need to play two defensive mids in front of them all season long again.

Yes Parkinson could have been bolder but at the end of the day he managed to get us just enough points to keep us up, even if the last game ended so dramatically.

Well that was a nice surprise coming off duty and expecting the worst. We need to consolidate for next term and decide who we are keeping and who will be on their bikes. A big surprise was Brum beating Fulham who were on the chance of automatic promotion and blew it so up their pipes and hope they get thrashed in the play offs. Now we need to concentrate on at least mid-table.

Sluffy wrote:All fair comment but I don't think things are as black and white as you make out.

I strongly suspect that there have been things going on behind the scenes that have effected players availability - maybe bonus payments triggered after a set number of games, or player loans only being granted on them having a guarantee of a set minimum number of first team games.

I also doubt very strongly that Parkinson has much of a say about what players are brought in or sold - his job is more about getting the best from what he has been given.

You may be right, I guess we'll have to wait for Parky's autobiography to find out the true picture behind the scenes (I'm buying 10 copies for Martin).

I can only go on what I see in front of me, and there's too much chopping and changing, too much long ball, and too many players off form or just fecking useless.

I do think he will be our manager next season, but if we kick off in August without a target man and a midfielder who isn't scared of the ball I'll be the first to say "Parky Out".

Just for the record -

From the 12th game of the season (We were only allowed to bring a defensive midfielder in after the embargo was lifted after game 9 - and allowing just two games for Henry to get match fit and settle in the side) until todays last game of the season we would have finished 15th in the league in front of teams like Leeds, Forest and Ipswich.

The worst three teams over the same period - Burton, Sunderland and Barnsley!

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Sluffy wrote:Just for the record -

From the 12th game of the season (We were only allowed to bring a defensive midfielder in after the embargo was lifted after game 9 - and allowing just two games for Henry to get match fit and settle in the side) until todays last game of the season we would have finished 15th in the league in front of teams like Leeds, Forest and Ipswich.

The worst three teams over the same period - Burton, Sunderland and Barnsley!

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And take out the first eleven and the last seven and where would we have finished?  After the break being six up, I thought 4 points would be enough to keep us up. It took way too long to get those points, but I am thankful for them.  9 shots on target today... a far cry from the past game.

Ffs.  We are staying up.  Save this for tomorrow.  We won, the sun is out.  Enjoy it

Sluffy wrote:Never had any doubts to be honest when I wrote what I did at the start of this thread.

Derby and Preston were never going to roll over so that meant we only had to win.

If we couldn't win our last game in front of our rabid fans against a team that had absolutely nothing to play for then we would have fully deserved to go down.

Tbf we made it much harder than I thought it would have been but with the fans fully behind us we got the result and I'm really pleased Wilbraham got the winner and Parkinson (started the season under an embargo - no defensive midfielder in the squad until the embargo was lifted 9 games (and only 2 points in), were being quoted at 1,500 to 1 AGAINST staying up by the bookies, and had his top scorer and the teams key player sold halfway through the season without a proper replacement) kept us up!

They did it despite the abuse they received from so many.

You never had any doubts? Come on now.

y2johnny wrote:Ffs.  We are staying up.  Save this for tomorrow.  We won, the sun is out.  Enjoy it

I'm never going near the sun again. All the second half the sun was assaulting my porcelain skin. I'll look like a beetroot in the morning.

Parky won’t be sacked, but I’d say there’s a slim chance he’ll walk.

Likelihood is though, he’ll be our manager next year, so it’s down to Anderson to back him now and bring in the target man we know we all need pronto. Whether that happens without investment is anyone’s guess.

T.R.O.Y wrote:

Sluffy wrote:Never had any doubts to be honest when I wrote what I did at the start of this thread.

Derby and Preston were never going to roll over so that meant we only had to win.

If we couldn't win our last game in front of our rabid fans against a team that had absolutely nothing to play for then we would have fully deserved to go down.

Tbf we made it much harder than I thought it would have been but with the fans fully behind us we got the result and I'm really pleased Wilbraham got the winner and Parkinson (started the season under an embargo - no defensive midfielder in the squad until the embargo was lifted 9 games (and only 2 points in), were being quoted at 1,500 to 1 AGAINST staying up by the bookies, and had his top scorer and the teams key player sold halfway through the season without a proper replacement) kept us up!

They did it despite the abuse they received from so many.

You never had any doubts? Come on now.

Why would I have had any doubts over three games of football on the last day of the season where the sides who were then 21st and 22nd in the league were playing away to the teams who were 6th and 7th in the league and who both were playing for the last play off place and we ourselves were at home against a team with nothing much to play for, when we (and the crowd) would know a win would almost certainly keep us up?

Seemed pretty obvious to me.

I though the chances of Barnsley and Burton winning away at Derby and Preston were non existence and that as such we held our own destiny in our hands if we simply won against a team that had only pride to play for (and how much does the average footballer these days worry to much about that?).

It wasn't really rocket science to come to the conclusion I did - the bigger shock to me were the vast number of others who didn't see such an obvious outcome and believed we would be relegated before a ball had even been kicked.