Just how is the Labour Opposition doing?

Sluffy wrote:

Norpig wrote:RLB is just a female version of Corbyn which won't attract old Labour voters back i reckon but we'll see. I get a vote through Unison but not seen any voting papers yet.

You won't as Unison has already endorsed Starmer.

Labour leadership: Unison endorses Sir Keir Starmer

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51035448


(Can't believe you thought Bonce would vote for anyone other than the most extreme leftist candidate in the race.  He'd be a bit of an hypocrite after all he's said on here over the years if he didn't).

Yes they are endorsing him but i do still get a vote which is on its way.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

T.R.O.Y wrote:Everyone’s got a different view on what we need to do and who we need to appeal to to get back into office, but so much of this is going to hinge on when the realities of Brexit are realised. Once the failed promises start to show will voters blame those who lied to them, or the negativity of remainers?

I'll definitely blame you. And xmiles.

No surprise there.

T.R.O.Y wrote:

Cajunboy wrote:It's Lisa Nandy all the way for me, no nonsense northern common sense can put Boris in his place. I saw her put down Andrew Neil a few weeks ago and that takes some doing.

Long- Bailey is basically Corbyn in knickers.

Starmer has the charisma of a dead donkey and always looks awkward whatever he is doing. 

Vote for Nandy or shoot yourselves in the head once again!!!!

I like Nandy a lot, it’s between her and Starmer for me. I’m more aligned to RLB’s policies but I just don’t buy into her as a leader personally.

Interesting you say vote Nandy or we’ll be in trouble, my dad (not a Labour voter) said the exact same thing to me about Starmer last week. 

Everyone’s got a different view on what we need to do and who we need to appeal to to get back into office, but so much of this is going to hinge on when the realities of Brexit are realised. Once the failed promises start to show will voters blame those who lied to them, or the negativity of remainers?

Sadly too many voters are easily fooled. Boris' election campaign was based on two basic points: getting brexit done (despite the fact that if he had supported May it would have been done already on slightly better terms) and promising to fix all the problems caused by Tory austerity (ignoring the fact that we wouldn't be in the mess we are in if the Tories had not systematically underfunded all aspects of social care).

So lunatics like that mad woman on Question Time will continue to vote Tory no matter what the evidence is.

As someone who doesn't give a toss about labour it can die for all i care looking at the candidates as a matter of amusement it seems to me that they should go for Nandy.

I've said Lisa Nandy literally from day 1. I think she would make a credible Opposition leader, whereas the other two have too much baggage.

gloswhite wrote:I've said Lisa Nandy literally from day 1. I think she would make a credible Opposition leader, whereas the other two have too much baggage.

Boris has more baggage than Gatwick. I'm assuming, rightly or wrongly, that you're a tory voter Glos, so, out of interest, what would it take to turn you?

boltonbonce wrote:

gloswhite wrote:I've said Lisa Nandy literally from day 1. I think she would make a credible Opposition leader, whereas the other two have too much baggage.

Boris has more baggage than Gatwick. I'm assuming, rightly or wrongly, that you're a tory voter Glos, so, out of interest, what would it take to turn you?

You're right, and have been for a few years now. I genuinely cannot see anything the other parties could offer that would make me change my views at this time. 
The Labour Party had one or two good ideas, but then just went what could only be described as 'ape-shit' when they tried to put it all together in a coherent manner, for the election.
Boris does bring some baggage, but most of it is to do with his private life, which doesn't interest me.

boltonbonce wrote:

gloswhite wrote:I've said Lisa Nandy literally from day 1. I think she would make a credible Opposition leader, whereas the other two have too much baggage.

Boris has more baggage than Gatwick. I'm assuming, rightly or wrongly, that you're a tory voter Glos, so, out of interest, what would it take to turn you?

I think I could vote for Lisa Nandy.

Just the sound of her name on my lips gives me a thrill, the shiny hair, the ............

Sorry I have to go.

Get a grip. Oh....you have.

George not too optimistic.

Plenty being said on here about the government but not so much on Labour. The party conference gave a really good insight into Labour's policies - whether they survive to the general election or not I don't know but there is a summary below - what do you think? (WS69 in particular )

DO THE MATH: Labour will train more primary teachers in maths and train ‘maths champions’ in nurseries, liven up maths lessons with real-world examples (Labour website)
1.5m HOMES: Keir Starmer’s main speech pledged 1.5 million homes over the next parliament (seemingly matching the old Tory 300,000-a-year pledge), a generation of ‘new towns’, hand mayors greater housing and planning powers, fast-track brownfield developments and a “blitz” of reforms to accelerate planning decisions. (Labour website)
POLICING GUARANTEE: Starmer pledged to guarantee police patrols in town centres, and repeat offenders also risk being banned from them under new powers. (Labour website)
STINKING RICH: Labour will empower regulators to ban bonuses to water chiefs whose firms pump excess sewage into rivers, and strengthen fines and powers to prosecute their leaders. (Labour website)
YOUTH CRIME PREVENTION: A new Young Futures scheme worth up to £100m will provide support to young people at risk of being drawn into violent crime. (Labour website)
ROADMAP FOR CAR FIRMS: A new “auto strategy” has been published, promising planning priority for new battery factories , 10-year research funding cycles, reliable electric car charging everywhere and critical mineral trade partnerships. (Labour website)
R&D CERTAINTY: Peter Kyle promised 10-year research and development funding settlements to support innovation with more “certainty” and “long-term partnerships” than under the Tories. (Research Professional News)
CORRUPTION AND CONSULTANCY CLAMPDOWN: A commissioner will be appointed to recover covid fraud, Labour will “aim to” halve consultancy spending in five years, and ministerial private jet use will be cut back, Reeves announced. (Labour website)
ENERGY INDEPENDENCE ACT: Ed Miliband has pledged an energy independence act, to “break Britain’s dependency on fossil fuel dictators”. (Mirror)
REWIRE BRITAIN: Labour says the queue for grid connections is “out of control” and it will remove the barriers to facilitate the largest upgrade to our national clean energy infrastructure in a generation, open up new grid construction to competitive tendering, and get GB Energy, Labour’s new publicly-owned energy company, to work in coordinating the transmission operators. (Labour website)
ANTI-HARASSMENT DUTY: Deputy leader Angela Rayner said in her women’s conference speech employers will face a new duty to take reasonable steps to stop sexual harassment (Labour website)
VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN:  Shadow Home Secretary Yvette Cooper said police willl “relentlessly pursue” those who pose threat to women through a new perpetrator programme (Labour website)
AFFORDABLE HOUSING: Rayner pledged Labour would deliver the biggest boost to affordable housing for a generation, unlocking government grants to deliver new homes by making the Affordable Housing Programme more flexible. The party said it would stop developers “wriggling out” of responsibilities (Labour website)
NEW TOWNS: Labour reportedly wants to build new towns next to existing rail connnections, considering building between London, Oxford and Cambridge. ([url=https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-labour-plan-housing-crisis-taxing-developers-new-towns-2670360?utm_medium=Newsletter&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_campaign=Editor%27s Choice]the i[/url])
GREENBELT REVIEW: Shadow Chancellor Rachel Reeves has suggested Labour will review greenbelt building rules. (Sunday Times)
£1.5bn TO CLEAR NHS BACKLOG: An estimated £1.5bn will be set aside to clear backlog through funding extra overtime and equipment, funded by scrapping non-dom status. (Sunday Mirror/People)
NHS TECH CASH: A new  £171m annual ‘Fit For The Future Fund’ will help replace outdated NHS equipment, helping cut waiting lists by equipment like CT and MRI scanners. (Labour website)
TRAINING COLLEGES: A revamped apprenticeship levy would fund specialist training colleges that equip workers for local industries, particularly in renewables, nuclear, engineering, computing and modern toolmaking. (The Observer.
MAINTENANCE GRANTS: Labour is “exploring” reviving maintenance grants for poorer students funded by higher interest rates on higher earners (The Telegraph)
DENTAL PLAN WITH TEETH: Labour will fund NHS dentists to offer 700,000 more urgent appointments, incentivise dentists to work in the most in-need areas, reform the NHS dental contract and start supervised toothbrushing for young children in schools in areas with most dental problems. (Labour website)

Bit of a mixed bag IMO but there are some things that I like and I think energy independence is crucial.

wanderlust wrote:Plenty being said on here about the government but not so much on Labour. The party conference gave a really good insight into Labour's policies - whether they survive to the general election or not I don't know but there is a summary below - what do you think? (WS69 in particular )

DO THE MATH: Labour will train more primary teachers in maths and train ‘maths champions’ in nurseries, liven up maths lessons with real-world examples (Labour website)
1.5m HOMES: Keir Starmer’s main speech pledged 1.5 million homes over the next parliament (seemingly matching the old Tory 300,000-a-year pledge), a generation of ‘new towns’, hand mayors greater housing and planning powers, fast-track brownfield developments and a “blitz” of reforms to accelerate planning decisions. (Labour website)
POLICING GUARANTEE: Starmer pledged to guarantee police patrols in town centres, and repeat offenders also risk being banned from them under new powers. (Labour website)
STINKING RICH: Labour will empower regulators to ban bonuses to water chiefs whose firms pump excess sewage into rivers, and strengthen fines and powers to prosecute their leaders. (Labour website)
YOUTH CRIME PREVENTION: A new Young Futures scheme worth up to £100m will provide support to young people at risk of being drawn into violent crime. (Labour website)
ROADMAP FOR CAR FIRMS: A new “auto strategy” has been published, promising planning priority for new battery factories , 10-year research funding cycles, reliable electric car charging everywhere and critical mineral trade partnerships. (Labour website)
R&D CERTAINTY: Peter Kyle promised 10-year research and development funding settlements to support innovation with more “certainty” and “long-term partnerships” than under the Tories. (Research Professional News)
CORRUPTION AND CONSULTANCY CLAMPDOWN: A commissioner will be appointed to recover covid fraud, Labour will “aim to” halve consultancy spending in five years, and ministerial private jet use will be cut back, Reeves announced. (Labour website)
ENERGY INDEPENDENCE ACT: Ed Miliband has pledged an energy independence act, to “break Britain’s dependency on fossil fuel dictators”. (Mirror)
REWIRE BRITAIN: Labour says the queue for grid connections is “out of control” and it will remove the barriers to facilitate the largest upgrade to our national clean energy infrastructure in a generation, open up new grid construction to competitive tendering, and get GB Energy, Labour’s new publicly-owned energy company, to work in coordinating the transmission operators. (Labour website)
ANTI-HARASSMENT DUTY: Deputy leader Angela Rayner said in her women’s conference speech employers will face a new duty to take reasonable steps to stop sexual harassment (Labour website)
VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN:  Shadow Home Secretary Yvette Cooper said police willl “relentlessly pursue” those who pose threat to women through a new perpetrator programme (Labour website)
AFFORDABLE HOUSING: Rayner pledged Labour would deliver the biggest boost to affordable housing for a generation, unlocking government grants to deliver new homes by making the Affordable Housing Programme more flexible. The party said it would stop developers “wriggling out” of responsibilities (Labour website)
NEW TOWNS: Labour reportedly wants to build new towns next to existing rail connnections, considering building between London, Oxford and Cambridge. ([url=https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-labour-plan-housing-crisis-taxing-developers-new-towns-2670360?utm_medium=Newsletter&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_campaign=Editor%27s Choice]the i[/url])
GREENBELT REVIEW: Shadow Chancellor Rachel Reeves has suggested Labour will review greenbelt building rules. (Sunday Times)
£1.5bn TO CLEAR NHS BACKLOG: An estimated £1.5bn will be set aside to clear backlog through funding extra overtime and equipment, funded by scrapping non-dom status. (Sunday Mirror/People)
NHS TECH CASH: A new  £171m annual ‘Fit For The Future Fund’ will help replace outdated NHS equipment, helping cut waiting lists by equipment like CT and MRI scanners. (Labour website)
TRAINING COLLEGES: A revamped apprenticeship levy would fund specialist training colleges that equip workers for local industries, particularly in renewables, nuclear, engineering, computing and modern toolmaking. (The Observer.
MAINTENANCE GRANTS: Labour is “exploring” reviving maintenance grants for poorer students funded by higher interest rates on higher earners (The Telegraph)
DENTAL PLAN WITH TEETH: Labour will fund NHS dentists to offer 700,000 more urgent appointments, incentivise dentists to work in the most in-need areas, reform the NHS dental contract and start supervised toothbrushing for young children in schools in areas with most dental problems. (Labour website)

Bit of a mixed bag IMO but there are some things that I like and I think energy independence is crucial.

Lusty, looks like a wish list to me but the one thing you’ve forgotten to add is where the moneys coming from to pay for them? Oh of course it’s Non-Doms and VAT on public schools. That ought to do it then.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Lusty, looks like a wish list to me but the one thing you’ve forgotten to add is where the moneys coming from to pay for them? Oh of course it’s Non-Doms and VAT on public schools. That ought to do it then.

Bit rich that as the Tories have achieved nothing despite borrowing more then any government in history Only to be expected really as it's a stock bit of Tory propaganda to try to cause alarm about "where the money is coming from" whenever there is a proposal to spend budget on the people instead of the rich.

Easy answer to your question is just borrow the money and increase the national debt as the Tories do.

Plus they'll save a fortune if they succeed in sorting out all the corruption in the current Government's procurement.

wanderlust wrote:
Bit rich that as the Tories have achieved nothing despite borrowing more then any government in history Only to be expected really as it's a stock bit of Tory propaganda to try to cause alarm about "where the money is coming from" whenever there is a proposal to spend budget on the people instead of the rich.

Easy answer to your question is just borrow the money and increase the national debt as the Tories do.

Plus they'll save a fortune if they succeed in sorting out all the corruption in the current Government's procurement.

Now that’s a typical Socialists answer to everything, let’s just borrow more money and stack it on our kids and grandkids bill. We’re already borrowed up to our eyeballs but let’s just borrow even more. I’m certainly not going to defend the Tories, I think their decisions to close the economy down during Covid was pure madness as is the needless expenditure on HS2 and the insane costs of rushing to net zero but don’t worry it’ll be the kids well into the future who’ll have to reap the storm of it. Typical myopic Labourite.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Now that’s a typical Socialists answer to everything, let’s just borrow more money and stack it on our kids and grandkids bill.

The Tories have always borrowed more and repaid less than Labour. FACT.

Since 1946 the average annual net borrowing whilst in government is Labour £19.7 billion whilst the Tories have an average annual net borrowing of a massive £31.7 billion!

The Tories are far and away the most profligate party with the biggest record of squandering away the public purse, borrowing massively and achieving the least with it. They are an economic disaster and if anyone has stacked it on our kids and grandkids it's the lying Toerags.

You need to stop reading the Daily Fail mate

FWIW I'll probably be voting LibDem again next time out - you know where I live so you can probably understand why.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Now that’s a typical Socialists answer to everything, let’s just borrow more money and stack it on our kids and grandkids bill. We’re already borrowed up to our eyeballs but let’s just borrow even more. I’m certainly not going to defend the Tories, I think their decisions to close the economy down during Covid was pure madness as is the needless expenditure on HS2 and the insane costs of rushing to net zero but don’t worry it’ll be the kids well into the future who’ll have to reap the storm of it. Typical myopic Labourite.

Unless climate change is addressed they won't have a future.

boltonbonce wrote:
Unless climate change is addressed they won't have a future.

Bonce, you need to tell the Chinese, Indians, Russians and Yanks that because nothing we do here is going to affect it one way or the other and that’s even assuming you believe all the doom merchants.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Bonce, you need to tell the Chinese, Indians, Russians and Yanks that because nothing we do here is going to affect it one way or the other and that’s even assuming you believe all the doom merchants.

Rubbish. Labour will nationalise air. Job done.

wanderlust wrote:
Rubbish. Labour will nationalise air. Job done.

Well they’ve tried everything else Lusty so maybe as part of their GB Energy farce? Interesting that you say you’ll vote Lib Dem, though yes I can understand why in your neck of the woods, but are there any policy reasons why? 

They certainly didn’t benefit from the by-elections this week but then apart from the result, neither did Labour really. It does beg the question are Labour as much of a shoe in as they seem to think they are? I’m not so sure and I still hold out a hope that if Rishi actually listens to the voters and amends policies in key areas instead of fannying about at the edges with smoking and other such irrelevancies, the Tory’s can still surprise on the up side. 

There still doesn’t seem any real love for Labour or Starmer and it’s more disaffection with the Tories than a belief in Labour policies so if Rishi can get some momentum (sorry for the pun) going all may not be lost yet. Sadly I just can’t see it happening but you have to keep on hoping one day they’ll see the light.