Be more German

Doesn't matter, I saw the perfect oppurtunity to spice things up but I dont think you're that bad tbh

Nicest thing anyone's ever said to me on here.

I've got your back

74
First of all I'm not your mate!
It wasn't the first time, I asked in a roundabout way before. We are supposedly on an austerity regime in this country at the moment, with cuts in welfare and benefit. Did that escape your notice? To simply suggest we are a wealthy country so we can afford it is not a n adequate answer. You, like me, haven't got a full idea about the country's finances, with the exception of there being haves and have not.
Ultimately more have nots will enter the country and this will have to be funded by tax increases more than likely. So if you are asking me to fund/agree to this as a working chap then the answer is simple.
Furthermore the fact I dislike folk who choose not to integrate in the society I have lived all my life strengthens my resolve. For the last 10 to 15 years I have thought that migrants from Africa and the Middle East tend to try to bring society down to their standards and not raise theirs' to ours.
In a perfect world and all that shit we wouldn't be debating this, but we are not, and enough is enough, time to pull up the drawbridge.

You don't need to tell me you don't like immigrants mate we've had this conversation enough times.

As I said, it seems you're pretty set on what you believe so I give up trying to alter those views. But you should remember the fact you were born in Britain doesn't automatically make you better than anybody else.

Thinking about it, a be more Trump thread could be more up your street SK. Just read he wants to deport 11 million immigrants! 

bwfc1874 wrote:You don't need to tell me you don't like immigrants mate we've had this conversation enough times.

As I said, it seems you're pretty set on what you believe so I give up trying to alter those views. But you should remember the fact you were born in Britain doesn't automatically make you better than anybody else.

Hallelujah. The fact you are a muslim doesn't make you any better, but in their eyes I'm an infidel, and so believe it or not, are you!
Unless of course you are one!?! Which would explain your stance.
I've had contact with immigrants long before you were jism, and indeed had Indian friends at school.
You make the assumption I don't like immigrants on the fact I claim to be an infidel. I don't like feckless immigrants who contribute knob all to society, of which there is a greater amount than there was ten years ago. Anybody coming into this country and paying their dues I have no problem with however we have enough British sponging bastards to cater for the swarms from outside.
As for the mate lark, mates are folk I go socialising with. Won't happen with you.

bwfc1874 wrote:Thinking about it, a be more Trump thread could be more up your street SK. Just read he wants to deport 11 million immigrants! 

You feed on being personal don't you? I don't need to say fuck all people will make there own mind up about you and indeed me.

You really can't take a joke, get a grip.

Some of the ignorant comments on here are causing me to feel depressed.

Soul Kitchen. You tell us what is so special about you that means you get a piece of paper saying you're allowed in this country while others aren't.

What did you personally do to earn the right to be here?

Nothing. You were born here, you got lucky.

If ISIS tore through your town tomorrow, murdered all your neighbours, raped your kids, set your house and car on fire and said they were going to take the rest of the country too - what would you do?
...

The people who are coming here as paupers, climbing fences in desperation, risking life and limb on sinking boats were the same as you and I 12 months ago. They had jobs, businesses, cars.

How would you feel if it happened to you. If you tried to get to France or America and the locals said "turn him away, all he wants is for us to look after him. Plus, what if he is a thief or rapist, we cant take that risk". "we cant afford to let him come with his family, send them back, i don't care if his wife and his mother are captured and sold as sex slaves because its more important that our kids get a good education and that we can build a new railway."

I would also like to add that I thought todays society was supposed to be humane. I thought that the English were different, more enlightened, had more of a moral conscience. It seems not to be the case.

The things I read daily on social media are as alarming as the things said about the Jews leading up to Ww2. We look back now and wonder how could they? How could a whole nation be so indoctrinated, so morally bankrupt as to allow something like that to happen.

It appears that the general consensus is that all immigrants and refugees are inherently bad. They are like dogs and to be treated as such. Apparantly they are not worth the same as us because we are somehow better.

But at what point does that 'Moral conscience' subside because the practical needs of the peoples of these islands at sometime have to overrule it? We take and have taken refugees since the year dot. There is a difference between immigrants and refugees. Refugees we should take as many as we can manage, immigrants we should keep to keep our services and industries manned. We cannot afford to keep our doors open for those who come here, and there are many (A swarm? lol) who feel it is a right to have the house and benefits. Some come from countries that are not a danger, others travel through friendly countries to reach the Northern European countries. Now there is an industry centred on Syria where for a few thousand you will be transported across the Med. Some days there a lots of flimsy boats, some rubber dinghies, all not fit for purpose and there are many each and every day. Not the UK but Jordan have accepted something like 4 million. Now there is another problem that will build. The tribalism of Sunni and Shia. They are at each others throat and have been for centuries and if it boils over on the streets of this country it will cost millions to solve, if ever. The Irish troubles will be a picnic by comparison. I am always at a loss to understand the Chinese settled here, no trouble, yet it seems every other nationality have found it difficult to integrate. Oh, and don't read too much on social media. Some of it isn't true.

This is an interesting thread, with the opinions and debate contained within it showing why this is one of the best forums around.

On the whole, after reading the whole thread, i think that 74 is right on what he is trying to get across. Ultimately a solution or compromise needs to be found. We as a society can't just let these people and their families suffer indefinitely just so we don't have to give up any of the relative luxuries we are afforded because we are lucky enough to have been born here. 74, lusty, breaders and biggie make a compelling argument as to why we should be helping more but on the other hand the points made by ballotom, norpig and even some of the views that sk and nat make have some credence to an extent. 

The european community as a whole need to put their heads together and work out a solution that shares the burden of responsibility that we have to save the lives of those that need saving. Unfortunately, as callous as it sounds, finances will always play a massive part in whether people live or die. People can't get life saving treatments on the nhs because it costs too much. I'm sure most of us would disagree with that happening but it is a fact that will never change.

I hope a compromise can be found in the long run because i am human and have compassion for those who suffer.

The immigration debate rambles on and on because in reality there are several issues lumped together and nobody seems to be willing or able to break it down in a logical way.
We're talking overpopulation/Malthusian doom, moral responsibility, economic viability, attitudes to cultural variance, political capital and whole bunch of other variables that send the debate round and round in circles.

However some of it could be broken down e.g. if there was a national will to take migrants who meet a set of criteria such as ability to pay their way and make an economic contribution similar to the Aussie system (i.e. not all refugees) it's very do-able. Simply set up a clearing house arrangement in the countries of origin, pre-vet applicants at source and put on safe transport (Navy?) to avoid the humanitarian crisis of illegal people smuggling. That way anyone who "qualified" would be welcomed and anyone on a raft, a boat or the back of a lorry would be readily identified and turned back as part of a European "gunboat diplomacy" exercise. Once that's in place, we could debate the fate of the rest with the EU as a separate issue but armed with the knowledge of how many migrants we are already taking.

No panacea but it would focus the debate and eliminate many of the arguments that currently confuse the issue.

the Aussie type rules was the only sensible policy UKIP had at the last election but as we are still part of Europe (for now) that can't happen i presume.

This country would not function without migrants coming in to do the jobs we English think are beneath us so as long as someone is coming in to work and contribute then that's all fine with me. 

The benefit culture in this country works both ways, yes there are people coming in from Eastern Europe to claim as much as they can but we also have a big underclass of British people who have never had a job and don't want one and do exactly the same.

best debate on this subject I have read anywhere, including the so called quality broadsheet comment sections

Chairmanda wrote:best debate on this subject I have read anywhere, including the so called quality broadsheet comment sections

 high praise for the Nutters 

Is there an election due?

(Only kidding, Mand.   )