HomeQuick question to everyone, if it was a choice of running the club within its means for the last 15 years and ensuring it continues as a club therefore missing out on europe etc, or keeping those days and the club ceasing to exist after this season what would you prefer.
decisions decisions
+10
Alf Hooker
observer
finlaymcdanger
luckyPeterpiper
Sluffy
Chairmanda
Jack Russell
wanderlust
boltonbonce
Norpig
14 posters
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2 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:07
Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
it has to be the first choice Johnny, i've been watching since the old 4th Division days and the lower league days still hold some of my best memories when watching BWFC.
3 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:10
boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Norpig wrote:it has to be the first choice Johnny, i've been watching since the old 4th Division days and the lower league days still hold some of my best memories when watching BWFC.
4 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:19
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
I'm generally happy if the team is doing their best regardless of the level we're at although it's great when we discover a new talent or sign a bargain which moves us up a level as we did under Rioch and Todd. Our success felt well-deserved and financially sustainable in those days.
What I didn't like was the period before that when we were "a selling club" and we had to watch the likes of Frannie Lee being prised away by the big spenders.
But under Rioch and Todd it was different. Selling Sasa Curcic to Villa for >£4 million didn't feel so much like the loss of a great player - more that we'd put one over on Villa and made a very handsome profit in the process.
So yes to living within our means, but some brilliant work in the transfer market and youth development to go with it please.
What I didn't like was the period before that when we were "a selling club" and we had to watch the likes of Frannie Lee being prised away by the big spenders.
But under Rioch and Todd it was different. Selling Sasa Curcic to Villa for >£4 million didn't feel so much like the loss of a great player - more that we'd put one over on Villa and made a very handsome profit in the process.
So yes to living within our means, but some brilliant work in the transfer market and youth development to go with it please.
5 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:22
Jack Russell
David Lee
Norpig wrote:it has to be the first choice Johnny, i've been watching since the old 4th Division days and the lower league days still hold some of my best memories when watching BWFC.
Me too
6 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:23
boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Selling Paul Fletcher to Burnley was a low point for me. Caused a great deal of bitterness.
7 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:26
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Those days were awful at times. Whenever we started to get a quality team together our best players would get nicked.boltonbonce wrote:Selling Paul Fletcher to Burnley was a low point for me. Caused a great deal of bitterness.
Worst for me was Peter Reid - mainly because it was George Wood that broke his leg and then Everton who signed him when he recovered. Thought he was going to be our captain - and the England captain for years to come.
8 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:38
Chairmanda
Andy Walker
great question. Like the majority so far, I'm going with option 1, but that is benefit of hindsight. Oh the roars of disapproval when it looks like "success" (defined as climbing the leagues) doesn't happen because some tightwad isn't putting their hand in their pocket and buying new players. Even now, there's a lot of "whoever comes in needs to invest in January so we can stay up" (I'm doing it and I should know better) irrespective of if that is sustainable or is predicated on the whims/continuing wealth/changing circs of a small group of individuals. We as fans always want the best of both worlds.
9 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 13:41
Sluffy
Admin
Safe and steady for me although football and society have both changed over the years and perhaps if we hadn't aimed to become better by splashing the cash, the crowds may have left us many years back and maybe we would have reached similar financial problems as we have now by another route?
At the end of the day football is simply an entertainment - if people are not happy with its product they vote with their feet.
The sad thing about all this is that we actually had established ourselves in the Premier League and basically pissed away our future with a series of tragic decisions. Clearly the turning point came with Allardyce leaving and the squad he left needing replacing due to its advancing age. Megson was not the man to do this crucial key task and consequently to counter the fan hatred of him this led to Coyle's disastrous appointment which I'm sure you all know my views on.
We could so easily have been very similar to how Stoke City are today - solid mid table, unfashionable but effective team - but instead we have become 'Joke' City instead, with the last half dozen years of inept management by the clubs hierarchy and its succession of team manager failures.
Oh well it is only a game!
At the end of the day football is simply an entertainment - if people are not happy with its product they vote with their feet.
The sad thing about all this is that we actually had established ourselves in the Premier League and basically pissed away our future with a series of tragic decisions. Clearly the turning point came with Allardyce leaving and the squad he left needing replacing due to its advancing age. Megson was not the man to do this crucial key task and consequently to counter the fan hatred of him this led to Coyle's disastrous appointment which I'm sure you all know my views on.
We could so easily have been very similar to how Stoke City are today - solid mid table, unfashionable but effective team - but instead we have become 'Joke' City instead, with the last half dozen years of inept management by the clubs hierarchy and its succession of team manager failures.
Oh well it is only a game!
Last edited by Sluffy on Thu Dec 17 2015, 15:00; edited 1 time in total
10 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 14:41
luckyPeterpiper
Ivan Campo
Secondedboltonbonce wrote:Norpig wrote:it has to be the first choice Johnny, i've been watching since the old 4th Division days and the lower league days still hold some of my best memories when watching BWFC.
11 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 15:17
finlaymcdanger
Frank Worthington
I personally enjoyed our time climbing the leagues, especially the White Hot Rioch era, more than any other in my years as a Wanderers fan. Witnessing the likes of Okocha, Campo, Djorkaeff, Hierro, Laville, Anelka etc. was the stuff that dreams are made of but there is nothing more enjoyable than winning promotion to my mind.
I'll take Reeves and Philliskirk or McGinlay, Lee and Walker any day of the week.
I'll take Reeves and Philliskirk or McGinlay, Lee and Walker any day of the week.
12 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 15:40
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Question is can we do it with Thomas, Woolery, Finney, Campbell-Young, Ceberio, Clayton, Holding, Clough etc? (I was going to put "et al" but some smartass would be asking what position Al plays) We also have Rob Hall and Tom Eaves lying around somewhere.finlaymcdanger wrote:I personally enjoyed our time climbing the leagues, especially the White Hot Rioch era, more than any other in my years as a Wanderers fan. Witnessing the likes of Okocha, Campo, Djorkaeff, Hierro, Laville, Anelka etc. was the stuff that dreams are made of but there is nothing more enjoyable than winning promotion to my mind.
I'll take Reeves and Philliskirk or McGinlay, Lee and Walker any day of the week.
Are they going to be the team of the future?
If we go into administration, I'd play the full development team every week to give them the game time to prepare for next season. We might get slaughtered but it'll surely fast track them and we'll go down prepared for a fight - and on a more even financial keel.
13 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 15:44
observer
Andy Walker
Quite correct... as we remember short term... not buying ALF (now we know why)... and longer term (not so long for many of you) when the club didn't give BSA the money to try and get a top four finish and Champions League play.Chairmanda wrote:great question. Like the majority so far, I'm going with option 1, but that is benefit of hindsight. Oh the roars of disapproval when it looks like "success" (defined as climbing the leagues) doesn't happen because some tightwad isn't putting their hand in their pocket and buying new players. Even now, there's a lot of "whoever comes in needs to invest in January so we can stay up" (I'm doing it and I should know better) irrespective of if that is sustainable or is predicated on the whims/continuing wealth/changing circs of a small group of individuals. We as fans always want the best of both worlds.
Your final line is apropos to all of those time... "we want the best of both worlds." How true!!!
14 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 15:57
Alf Hooker
David Lee
And to make matters worse, if I recall rightly that bloody match got abandoned at half time too . . bloody snow!!wanderlust wrote:Those days were awful at times. Whenever we started to get a quality team together our best players would get nicked.boltonbonce wrote:Selling Paul Fletcher to Burnley was a low point for me. Caused a great deal of bitterness.
Worst for me was Peter Reid - mainly because it was George Wood that broke his leg and then Everton who signed him when he recovered. Thought he was going to be our captain - and the England captain for years to come.
15 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 16:08
doffcocker
Ivan Campo
The thing is it didn't actually cost £180m to consistently finish top 8, qualify for Europe, etc. So when people link the shit we're in now to the "glory years" we had in the Prem I find it very sad. We had the potential when Allardyce left - not necessarily to carry on competing at that level - but to operate as a safe PL club without getting into serious financial problems. Even though that didn't happen you still have to wonder where all that money has gone. Sure we've spent more than we've had coming in over the years but is it fairly reflected by the net debt figure? Looking at that of other clubs at this level I wouldn't say so.
16 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 16:13
Guest
Guest
New Year's day 1979.
My Dad says I was there with him but I can't honestly remember anything about it because I was only 8.
My Dad says I was there with him but I can't honestly remember anything about it because I was only 8.
17 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 16:22
rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Breadman wrote:New Year's day 1979.
My Dad says I was there with him but I can't honestly remember anything about it because I was only 8.
......and the only reason it was allowed to start was because the police didn't want thousands of Everton supporters tying to do U turns on the East Lancs road because of the snow. The ref was Trelford Mills- and one of the linesmen that day now works for a business in Ramsbottom. And he told me all about it one night when he was in his cups.
18 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 16:26
rammywhite
Frank Worthington
Don't know if I agree with all of the above- if we get out of this mess then views might change.
The years in the Prem when we were beating all the big boys with some great international players were great days,the likes of which most/all of us will never see again.
We're not in such a bad place now ,if we can find a way out of the current situation.
The years in the Prem when we were beating all the big boys with some great international players were great days,the likes of which most/all of us will never see again.
We're not in such a bad place now ,if we can find a way out of the current situation.
19 Re: decisions decisions Thu Dec 17 2015, 17:11
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
There were delays and by the time I got in it was almost 20 minutes after the start. We played with an orange ball and red shirts due to the heavy snow. I missed our goal, watched in horror as a back pass (Greavesy?) stuck in the snow and gifted them an equaliser, Reidy breaking his leg and then not getting our money back because the game had reached HT.rammywhite wrote:Breadman wrote:New Year's day 1979.
My Dad says I was there with him but I can't honestly remember anything about it because I was only 8.
......and the only reason it was allowed to start was because the police didn't want thousands of Everton supporters tying to do U turns on the East Lancs road because of the snow. The ref was Trelford Mills- and one of the linesmen that day now works for a business in Ramsbottom. And he told me all about it one night when he was in his cups.
Everton and others had enquired about Reidy the previous season and a figure of £180k had been bandied about. But after they broke his leg, they got him for less than half that because now he was "injury prone". Bastards.
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