HomeThank you very much Sluffy!Sluffy wrote:Calling all Bolton fans - which clubs are our rivals? A request for our help from Loughborough University. Would be great if you spare Conor a few moments with his questions and also a RT @OfficialBWFC @MarcIles @LionOfViennaSte @TheJackDearden @ProudBW @DanBarnesJourno Thanks!
— Bolton Nuts(@BoltonNuts) September 6, 2022
Message [Page 4 of 5]
61 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 11:37
Conor_Student21
David Ngog
62 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 11:41
Conor_Student21
David Ngog
I will definitely be sticking around. It's very interesting to learn about this side of a football club other than my own!Ten Bobsworth wrote:I do hope you stick around, Conor.
If you want to know about balance sheets you could check out the Loughborough Uni library for Sam Allardyce's book, 'Accounting and Finance for Dummies'. Search for it under 'Fiction'.
63 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 12:12
Sluffy
Admin
Conor_Student21 wrote:I will definitely be sticking around. It's very interesting to learn about this side of a football club other than my own!Ten Bobsworth wrote:I do hope you stick around, Conor.
If you want to know about balance sheets you could check out the Loughborough Uni library for Sam Allardyce's book, 'Accounting and Finance for Dummies'. Search for it under 'Fiction'.
Hope you do Conor but beware because there's a lot of history (and not all of it good) in respect of the club's financial position - both now since the takeover by Football Ventures (FV), the period prior to that when our long term benefactor Eddie Davies sold the club to Dean Holdsworth and Ken Anderson and the club feel into Administration, and Eddie Davies ownership period where our manager at the time - Sam Allardyce ideas on finances left a lot to be desired!
Parallel to all that the reporting of the club's finances were clearly not understood by the local paper's reporter, Marc Iles and his lack of knowledge and outspokenness on the subject caused a great deal of fan antipathy towards the clubs owners.
Probably best not to get yourself in too deep at all (unless it is your own club of course) and just accept that the vast majority of fans simply don't understand nor care about the financial running of clubs - yet it is the financial running of clubs that ultimately determine what happens on the pitch.
Look at Leicester now if you want a current example of how it does!
64 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 12:15
Sluffy
Admin
Conor_Student21 wrote:Thank you very much Sluffy!Sluffy wrote:Calling all Bolton fans - which clubs are our rivals? A request for our help from Loughborough University. Would be great if you spare Conor a few moments with his questions and also a RT @OfficialBWFC @MarcIles @LionOfViennaSte @TheJackDearden @ProudBW @DanBarnesJourno Thanks!
— Bolton Nuts
You are welcome Conor and a shout out to Marc Iles who seems to be the only one to have re-tweeted so far.
However he is widely followed and hopefully by now people have started to respond to your survey.
65 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 13:08
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
Sluffy wrote:
Hope you do Conor but beware because there's a lot of history (and not all of it good) in respect of the club's financial position - both now since the takeover by Football Ventures (FV), the period prior to that when our long term benefactor Eddie Davies sold the club to Dean Holdsworth and Ken Anderson and the club feel into Administration, and Eddie Davies ownership period where our manager at the time - Sam Allardyce ideas on finances left a lot to be desired!
Parallel to all that the reporting of the club's finances were clearly not understood by the local paper's reporter, Marc Iles and his lack of knowledge and outspokenness on the subject caused a great deal of fan antipathy towards the clubs owners.
Probably best not to get yourself in too deep at all (unless it is your own club of course) and just accept that the vast majority of fans simply don't understand nor care about the financial running of clubs - yet it is the financial running of clubs that ultimately determine what happens on the pitch.
Look at Leicester now if you want a current example of how it does!
Its true that there was a lot Iles didn't understand, Sluffy, but he knew enough to know that he was painting a grossly one-sided and distorted picture leaving out everything that did not suit his prejudices. He was banned from the stadium by former chairman, Phil Gartside, and later banned again by Ken Anderson, neither of these decisions likely to have been undertaken lightly.
The sale of the club to the ludicrously named Sports Shield consortium was not a sale at all. Eddie Davies had spent his substantial life earnings sustaining BWFC and, as a man with a latent heart condition, needed to remove the stress to preserve his life for a bit longer.
He simply handed it over seemingly with an unrecorded or unpublished undertaking to Anderson that he would put into the club (when needed) an amount equivalent to the amount he would otherwise have had to pay to administrators. It avoided immediate administration and bought more time to find a new owner.
It would ultimately fail but only after Eddie had once again paid off the Holdsworth/ Blumarble mortgage on the stadium before dying almost immediately.
Ten bob (or 50P in new money) was the amount Dean Holdsworth 'paid' for half the club and the hotel. He walked off with a lot but that has never been published in the Bolton News.
66 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 13:18
Sluffy
Admin
Ten Bobsworth wrote:It's true that there was a lot Iles didn't understand, Sluffy, but he knew enough to know that he was painting a grossly one-sided and distorted picture leaving out everything that did not suit his prejudices. He was banned from the stadium by former chairman, Phil Gartside, and later banned again by Ken Anderson, neither of these decisions likely to have been undertaken lightly.
The sale of the club to the ludicrously named Sports Shield consortium was not a sale at all. Eddie Davies had spent his substantial life earnings sustaining BWFC and, as a man with a latent heart condition, needed to remove the stress to preserve his life for a bit longer.
He simply handed it over seemingly with an unrecorded or unpublished undertaking to Anderson that he would put into the club (when needed) an amount equivalent to the amount he would otherwise have had to pay to administrators. It avoided immediate administration and bought more time to find a new owner.
It would ultimately fail but only after Eddie had once again paid off the Holdsworth/ Blumarble mortgage on the stadium before dying almost immediately.
Ten bob (or 50P in new money) was the amount Dean Holdsworth 'paid' for half the club and the hotel. He walked off with a lot but that has never been published in the Bolton News.
Thanks Bob, I knew all that, I just didn't think it would benefit Conor very much from looking to deeply into all that had happened here with Bolton (and Mr Iles).
Up to him of course but if he was interested in such things then I suggest he started off by finding out about his own club first.
That's all I meant in my post above.
67 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 13:30
Conor_Student21
David Ngog
That's a lot of info to take in so I'll read up on it all and see if I can understand it all.Sluffy wrote:
Thanks Bob, I knew all that, I just didn't think it would benefit Conor very much from looking to deeply into all that had happened here with Bolton (and Mr Iles).
Up to him of course but if he was interested in such things then I suggest he started off by finding out about his own club first.
That's all I meant in my post above.
68 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 13:31
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
Conor doesn't need to know all that, Sluffy, but he is young and it may help to understand that things you read in newspapers are not always the whole truth. In fact there's been precious little written anywhere that casts a competent or true light on Bolton's financial woes.
And, of course, there are many who don't want to know the truth either about the past or the present.
And, of course, there are many who don't want to know the truth either about the past or the present.
69 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 14:28
Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Conor stop being polite and escape Waldorf and Stadler as soon as you can, we're all stuck with them on here 
70 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 15:06
Sluffy
Admin
Norpig wrote:Conor stop being polite and escape Waldorf and Stadler as soon as you can, we're all stuck with them on here
Hopefully Conor knows by now there are all sorts of crazies on social media and not to take anyone he doesn't already know in his real life, seriously on there!
All the financial stuff at our club does interest Bob and I but very few other Wanderers fans out there and here on Nuts too!
Maybe we are seen to be somewhat 'boring' and irrelevant and are of no interest to anyone else but who cares - certainly not I nor Bob either I expect.
Just leave us be to whitter away about the club's finances to ourselves and you never know, we might one day help you to understand what is going on if and when that brown stuff hits the fan again!
Hopefully it won't and you never do need us to explain what really happened and why!
71 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 15:23
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
Norpig wrote:Conor stop being polite and escape Waldorf and Stadler as soon as you can, we're all stuck with them on here
When Sam Allardyce walked out of his ten-year contract with Bolton he claimed he was taking a break from football yet turned up at Newcastle in next to no time doubling his £1.5m p.a. salary.
Gartside was livid. Some fans blamed Gartside and Davies with Gartside describing those sort as numpties.
I'd be interested to know what Norpig had to say. I'd be surprised if it was anything illuminating. Illumination has never seemed to be quite Norpig's thing.
72 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 16:07
Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
It was in jest SluffySluffy wrote:
Hopefully Conor knows by now there are all sorts of crazies on social media and not to take anyone he doesn't already know in his real life, seriously on there!
All the financial stuff at our club does interest Bob and I but very few other Wanderers fans out there and here on Nuts too!
Maybe we are seen to be somewhat 'boring' and irrelevant and are of no interest to anyone else but who cares - certainly not I nor Bob either I expect.
Just leave us be to whitter away about the club's finances to ourselves and you never know, we might one day help you to understand what is going on if and when that brown stuff hits the fan again!
Hopefully it won't and you never do need us to explain what really happened and why!
I have tried to make sense but as Bob says i must be a numb nuts.
73 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 16:11
Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Allardyce left because he was told there was no more money to take us the next level as far as i'm aware but obviously Bob is the font of all knowledge and is never wrong.Ten Bobsworth wrote:
When Sam Allardyce walked out of his ten-year contract with Bolton he claimed he was taking a break from football yet turned up at Newcastle in next to no time doubling his £1.5m p.a. salary.
Gartside was livid. Some fans blamed Gartside and Davies with Gartside describing those sort as numpties.
I'd be interested to know what Norpig had to say. I'd be surprised if it was anything illuminating. Illumination has never seemed to be quite Norpig's thing.
The only interest you have Bob is what comes out of your own mouth you pompous old fuckwit.
74 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 16:35
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
Norpig wrote:
Allardyce left because he was told there was no more money to take us the next level as far as i'm aware but obviously Bob is the font of all knowledge and is never wrong.
The only interest you have Bob is what comes out of your own mouth you pompous old fuckwit.
QED
75 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 17:13
Sluffy
Admin
Norpig wrote:
It was in jest Sluffy
I have tried to make sense but as Bob says i must be a numb nuts.
I know mate and took it as such.
You are clearly not a numb nuts or you would not be holding such a responsible job as you do, you simply haven't been trained in the things Bob and I have which gives us the knowledge and skills to do the jobs we did in our work careers and which gives us a better understanding of the happenings we know about and have been put in to the public domain in regards to finances at the club.
I guess it is a bit of a horses for courses type of thing, you have an interest and understanding of apothecary and I don't but I have an interest and understand how companies are legally required to work and you don't.
Simple as that really.
It would be boring if we were all the same!
As for Allardyce he had said often he wanted to retire before he turned 55 and when he left Bolton he said it was to spend more time with his family.
About two weeks later he rocked up as Newcastle manager, poached all of our backroom analysis staff (and a player or two as well) and went on to manage his last club last year aged 66!
Allardyce confirms early retirement plans
BOLTON boss Sam Allardyce has re-iterated his desire to retire from football management at 55. The manager celebrates his 50th birthday next month - and by then could have sealed a new, improved five-year contract.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/allardyce-confirms-early-retirement-plans-1122929
I would not believe all he claimed!!!
Last edited by Sluffy on Wed Sep 07 2022, 17:43; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Spelling mistake)
76 Re: Rivalries Wed Sep 07 2022, 17:23
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Bob, if you were at a BBQ with Lady Bobsworth would you jump the hot dog queue?
77 Re: Rivalries Thu Sep 08 2022, 05:57
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
The cult of numptiness (or totally unrealistic expectations) seemed to take root during the Allardyce years and it hasn’t really gone away. MU hated coming to the Reebok where they could be guaranteed a hostile reception from the crowd and more than a few crunching tackles and, whilst there were no victories celebrated with the same fervour as those over the Rags, sadly they weren’t as frequent as they had been in the 50’s.
Relegation in 2012 may have ended it all except that an FA Cup match at the Reebok today would inevitably result in renewed hostilities and a large police presence.
Relegation in 2012 may have ended it all except that an FA Cup match at the Reebok today would inevitably result in renewed hostilities and a large police presence.
78 Re: Rivalries Fri Sep 09 2022, 11:34
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
Conor may have noticed that, except for Sluffy, there's not much interest on Nuts in the heritage and history of Bolton Wanderers or the circumstances that nearly brought about the club's demise. But its not much different on any of the other forums either tbh
Starved of any real success since 1958, I tend to think that the Allardyce years brought about a kind of collective madness/blindness.
But if we go back to 1939, prior to the outbreak of war there was little sign of any interest or rivalry with Man U. Bolton was a more successful club, consistently finishing higher than the Rags in the League table and winning the FA Cup three times in seven years in the1920s.
City were of more interest. In fact the home league game against Man U attracted the lowest attendance of the season in 1938/39 with just over 10,000 spectators at Burnden Park.
I'm sure that it was that article in the BEN that changed things, starkly contrasting the two clubs response to the governments call for young men to join the Territorial Army followed by the tragic death in action of the heroic Harry Goslin.
The story doesn't end there but we can save the rest for another day.
Starved of any real success since 1958, I tend to think that the Allardyce years brought about a kind of collective madness/blindness.
But if we go back to 1939, prior to the outbreak of war there was little sign of any interest or rivalry with Man U. Bolton was a more successful club, consistently finishing higher than the Rags in the League table and winning the FA Cup three times in seven years in the1920s.
City were of more interest. In fact the home league game against Man U attracted the lowest attendance of the season in 1938/39 with just over 10,000 spectators at Burnden Park.
I'm sure that it was that article in the BEN that changed things, starkly contrasting the two clubs response to the governments call for young men to join the Territorial Army followed by the tragic death in action of the heroic Harry Goslin.
The story doesn't end there but we can save the rest for another day.
79 Re: Rivalries Fri Sep 09 2022, 12:15
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Bob, why do you hate BWFC so much?
80 Re: Rivalries Fri Sep 09 2022, 13:07
Ten Bobsworth
Frank Worthington
I’m not sure if they have found a cure yet for acute Allardymer’s Disease. You could seek advice from your GP.Natasha Whittam wrote:Bob, why do you hate BWFC so much?
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