Hillsborough

Breadman wrote:http://www.itv.com/news/2016-04-29/retired-police-officer-i-disagree-with-hillsborough-inquest-findings/

This guy's being vilified by the media for saying what a lot of us believe to be true.

He's probably at the age where he's comfortable enough with who he is to be able to say: "Fuck it, I know what happened and I'm not afraid to give my opinion because I was there and I know what went on. If you don't like it that's your problem."

It's just a shame that the way the modern world works, he'll be slagged off across social media and then as a direct result, then be hung out to dry by the popular press who take their lead from what appears to be popular on Twitter and Facebook, without serious consideration of his (qualified) opinion and then be branded a bitter old fool.

Just because it's currently "en vogue" to heap praise on the Hillsborough campaigners and automatically dismiss the opinions of anyone who contradicts them.

We used to be better than that.

As others have already said, it's inconceivable for some of us older contributors to accept that it's all done now and the Liverpool fans were all heroes.

Bollocks.

I watched his interview on TV and I thought he came across quite well. Certain elements tried to twist his words but when you listen to what he had to say I thought he was probably on point. Especially as he was there on the day. Strangely enough..there is no mention of him giving evidence at the Hillsborough investigation. Now why is that?

As was said very eloquently previously I don't think anyone blames Liverpool fans as a whole as the ones killed were the ones that followed the protocol were inside and enjoying the atmosphere so by any definition these people were truly victims.
For me the blame comes from outside and there are a number of factors there including large numbers of people without tickets charging the turnstiles and creating an atmosphere that led the police to believe that had action not been taken then loss of life or serious injury was possible there, had no action been taken and lives had been lost then the police would have been vilified for taking no action and letting it happen, with hindsight it was a bad call but they didn't have hindsight at the time. the previous poster went on top point out that it could have happened to any clubs fans but the fact remains that it hasn't despite many of them attending semi finals at Hillsborough on many occasions,add to that the same thing nearly happened again at Liverpool's Champions League final in Athens and the Heysal Disaster non of which has happened to Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea or any other big Club you have to think they have a section of their fans who have no respect for anyone or anything.
I have attended many matches at Liverpool including the White Hot night where Liverpool fans applauded the Bolton team on the pitch and have found the vast majority of Liverpool fans to be generous and fair minded, but the one thing I would point to is their refusal to hold this minority of their fans culpable for any of the disasters or near disasters caused at least partly by them.
Regarding the verdict it was always going to go the way it did because the jury aren't legal experts but a committee of Husbands, Wives, Mothers and Fathers who have heard for 20 odd years about how families of the victims lives were destroyed by what happened, but after 20 odd years what the decision was based on was emotional and anecdotal. The police with hindsight did get it wrong and if they have lied and  deliberately covered things up since then shame on them and they should certainly be punished for that but unlawful killing is wrong in my opinion, and the fact that the minority who certainly forced the police into a decision by their actions are being completely exonerated is just as wrong IMO.

whatsgoingon wrote:As was said very eloquently previously I don't think anyone blames Liverpool fans as a whole as the ones killed were the ones that followed the protocol were inside and enjoying the atmosphere so by any definition these people were truly victims.
For me the blame comes from outside and there are a number of factors there including large numbers of people without tickets charging the turnstiles and creating an atmosphere that led the police to believe that had action not been taken then loss of life or serious injury was possible there, had no action been taken and lives had been lost then the police would have been vilified for taking no action and letting it happen, with hindsight it was a bad call but they didn't have hindsight at the time. the previous poster went on top point out that it could have happened to any clubs fans but the fact remains that it hasn't despite many of them attending semi finals at Hillsborough on many occasions,add to that the same thing nearly happened again at Liverpool's Champions League final in Athens and the Heysal Disaster non of which has happened to Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea or any other big Club you have to think they have a section of their fans who have no respect for anyone or anything.
I have attended many matches at Liverpool including the White Hot night where Liverpool fans applauded the Bolton team on the pitch and have found the vast majority of Liverpool fans to be generous and fair minded, but the one thing I would point to is their refusal to hold this minority of their fans culpable for any of the disasters or near disasters caused at least partly by them.
Regarding the verdict it was always going to go the way it did because the jury aren't legal experts but a committee of Husbands, Wives, Mothers and Fathers who have heard for 20 odd years about how families of the victims lives were destroyed by what happened, but after 20 odd years what the decision was based on was emotional and anecdotal. The police with hindsight did get it wrong and if they have lied and  deliberately covered things up since then shame on them and they should certainly be punished for that but unlawful killing is wrong in my opinion, and the fact that the minority who certainly forced the police into a decision by their actions are being completely exonerated is just as wrong IMO.

You need to post more often. You certainly seem to know what's going on. 

WGO, good post