Economy watch

NickFazer wrote:So the central beaurocracy would be better off improving its tax laws than trying to collect tax retrospectively.

NickFazer wrote:Ok. I will try although in your opinion I am most likely poor, xenophobic, ignorant and a racist, comments for the record that are extremely offensive and are of a similar tone you accuse "Brexit fans" of.



1. how is voting the way the owners of the Times, Sun, Daily Mail, Telegraph, Boris and Farage want voting against the establishment?

It isn't, the press, the media in general and Messrs Johnson and Farage are as much establishment as those advocating Remain there could not be an anti-establishment vote. The anti establishment veiw would be towards those perceived to have ignored /disenfranchised them, the Old School Tie brigade in Cameron and Osbourne, a former Labour leader whom has squirmed his way through the inquiry into the Iraq war and enriched himself greatly in the process, the money men who brought the economy to its knees but have sailed on serenely since, bankers, and theIMF, leaders of "Big Business" Richard Brandon et al and also and the entitled, celebrities with their self centred reasons for maintaining the status quo to enable them to flit effortlessly around Europe. Bob Geldoff, especially his stunt on the Thames with his Luvvie pals abusing fisherman and glugging champagne did the Remain cause some damage on the ITN and BBC News bulletins. These aren't my personal views, despicable though some of these people are but I don't doubt that those mentioned were the ones anyone wanting to stick two fingers up to the establishment had in mind.

2. how likely is it that voting the way they want you to is going to be good for most people in this country? It is no more likely or unlikely than if we remain. The argument can never be proved as we will never know what the future would have held if we had stayed in, it is a ridiculous question as Leavers obviously see a brighter future outside and Remainers inside. What should have happened is that there should have been a sensible debate by those in a position to put over their view, in language that the general public could understand, in the absence of that most people considered there own position just as you would at a General Election. The predominant view on here appears to be that Boris and the Leave campaign had a large influence on the poorer and less enlightened to vote leave with falsehoods and to a degree that is true, to what extent nobody knows but the influence of "Project Fear" for want of a better phrase and how many may have been influenced by that is hardly mentioned. My own outlook is that economically over the medium to long term it will be of slight benefit, being free of the Euro has enabled us to effect something of a recovery as is and plenty of countries manage to trade perfectly well with the Eurozone and EU from outside the EU, EEA and even EFTA. In addition the economic performance of the EU has been disappointing for a long time and as it's institutions and beaurocracy stifle innovation and discourage growth the UK will not need to achieve stellar growth to outperform the EU.

3. do you honestly believe that a UK outside the EU is going to be more likely to stand up to big business, protect workers' rights and look after the environment?

Big business - No the EU in theory at least has more clout and it will be interesting to see how the get on with the case against Apple but this will be a long  protracted case so we will have to wait for the outcome, interesting though that Ireland doesn't want this to go ahead. All government's across the world have this problem not just in Europe or the UK and as long as tax havens and off shore accounts exist then they will be taken advantage of, unless Apple have done something illegal as opposed to immoral then this may come to nothing.

The Environment - The EU has done many good things in this area and it would be a shame if a lot of good work was to come undone but it is not an unqualified success, there is an argument, not sure if it true or not that we are no longer allowed to dredge rivers and estuary's which has been blamed for some of the floods in recent years. On leaving we will have to look to pressure and special interest groups to keep the government on the straight an narrow. In any case there is no reason why we have to stop co-operating on such matters just because we are no longer members same would apply to science and research organisations.

Workers Rights - Workers rights, existing ones are already enshrined in law and although you wouldn't put it past government to fancy reworking them on occasion they have got to do legally and they can be challenged. Ultimately I believe that workers rights are a matter for national governments, it is precisely this obsession of having Europe wide legislation that has to apply to all weather it is appropriate or not that has got EU in such a state as it finds itself today. Besides being in the EU has not stopped zero hours contracts and other piss takes over the years but has made it practically impossible for Eurozone companies to shed staff when necessary and as a result they are reluctant to take on staff, hence high unemployment and stagnant growth.

Anyhoo, that's my two cents, off out now for six pints of white lightening and to abuse some ethnic minorities.

NickFazer wrote:Yes I agree that blocks of countries can cooperate in  all all manner of things more effectively than one nation by itself, I just don't think that you need to create a superstate with a single currency, a parliament, a commission, a president, several presidents actually and a court of justice to achieve it. Its a difficult road to go down, especially when the member nations are so culturally and  economically diverse.

NickFazer wrote:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/08/31/apple-travesty-is-a-reminder-why-britain-must-leave-the-lawless/

May be why TTIP talks aren't going well, seems the US seriously not happy with Brussels.

NickFazer wrote:TTIP talks look like failing, 4 or 5 years of negotiating up to now. Both sides will blame each other of course but I believe the US can be particularly difficult negotiators.