2018 Budget

No, I just missed him!

Bastards. I deserve respect. I made the tea cosy fashionable.

Having looked at it now, I can see it's a budget for the rich unless the rich want a divided society, poor health care, crap education for their kids, social unrest, increased crime, higher incidence of mental health problems and a low wage society that increasingly resents them.
I guess it all comes down to being rich enough to have private healthcare, private education and jobs lined up for their kids and a home in a low crime area like Norfolk for instance.

No surprises then! What do you expect from the Tories?

Predictable from the Labour Twins.

xmiles wrote:No surprises then! What do you expect from the Tories?

Nothing less TBH. For me personally, the budget has little impact other than the increased taxes on wine (!), holidays, selling property and the effect on the public services I use. If I was a selfish bastard it wouldn't bother me too much, but I am concerned about my kids inheriting a divided and increasingly volatile society and I am concerned for the majority of British people who aren't as lucky as me who will take the brunt of it.
I'd have been a lot happier if they hadn't raised the upper tax threshold (or even reduced it) but instead had raised the lower threshold by a higher amount to help those struggling to get by. Don't see the point of making the rich richer if it means increased crime, poverty and illness and decreased education and public services for the many. It can only lead to trouble.

An end to austerity, that made me laugh! Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of people struggling with Universal credit and using foodbanks.

Norpig wrote:An end to austerity, that made me laugh! Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of people struggling with Universal credit and using foodbanks.

They, along with the homeless and mental health sufferers don't exist in Toryland. The Police, Local Councils, NHS workers and Teachers are already lined up to be sacrificed next to keep their millionaire backers happy in their foreign homes.

I agree that the budget doesn't go nearly far enough but no government, Tory or Labour, will ever be brave enough to make the tough decisions that actually make things fairer.

1) Stop making the NHS "free for everyone". Make all those people having treatment for conditions they brought on themselves PAY FOR THEIR FUCKING TREATMENT. If some obese person wants a gastric band, make them pay for it. If someone smoked 80 fags a day or drank 20 pints every night, don't be wasting resources on them. If they want help, make them pay. Also, while clearly not their own fault, couples who want IVF should be paying. Not having children is not a sickness or disease. There are people with cancer not getting the drugs they need because couples are getting £5,000 per cycle for IVF.

2) Stop paying for people to have children. Stop handing out child benefit, stop handing out free nursery places. We seem to have reached a situation where people have kids and then expect the taxpayer to pay for them. If you want a kid, then fucking pay for him or her.

These two obvious changes would transform the budget for the NHS, universal credit, mental health etc. I can't imagine any decent, sane person not agreeing with me. 25 stone Janice with 4 kids from Crawley, probably not so much.

Natasha Whittam wrote:I agree that the budget doesn't go nearly far enough but no government, Tory or Labour, will ever be brave enough to make the tough decisions that actually make things fairer.

1) Stop making the NHS "free for everyone". Make all those people having treatment for conditions they brought on themselves PAY FOR THEIR FUCKING TREATMENT. If some obese person wants a gastric band, make them pay for it. If someone smoked 80 fags a day or drank 20 pints every night, don't be wasting resources on them. If they want help, make them pay. Also, while clearly not their own fault, couples who want IVF should be paying. Not having children is not a sickness or disease. There are people with cancer not getting the drugs they need because couples are getting £5,000 per cycle for IVF.

2) Stop paying for people to have children. Stop handing out child benefit, stop handing out free nursery places. We seem to have reached a situation where people have kids and then expect the taxpayer to pay for them. If you want a kid, then fucking pay for him or her.

These two obvious changes would transform the budget for the NHS, universal credit, mental health etc. I can't imagine any decent, sane person not agreeing with me. 25 stone Janice with 4 kids from Crawley, probably not so much.

Great post NAT.

Natasha Whittam wrote:I agree that the budget doesn't go nearly far enough but no government, Tory or Labour, will ever be brave enough to make the tough decisions that actually make things fairer.

1) Stop making the NHS "free for everyone". Make all those people having treatment for conditions they brought on themselves PAY FOR THEIR FUCKING TREATMENT. If some obese person wants a gastric band, make them pay for it. If someone smoked 80 fags a day or drank 20 pints every night, don't be wasting resources on them. If they want help, make them pay. Also, while clearly not their own fault, couples who want IVF should be paying. Not having children is not a sickness or disease. There are people with cancer not getting the drugs they need because couples are getting £5,000 per cycle for IVF.

2) Stop paying for people to have children. Stop handing out child benefit, stop handing out free nursery places. We seem to have reached a situation where people have kids and then expect the taxpayer to pay for them. If you want a kid, then fucking pay for him or her.

These two obvious changes would transform the budget for the NHS, universal credit, mental health etc. I can't imagine any decent, sane person not agreeing with me. 25 stone Janice with 4 kids from Crawley, probably not so much.

I like it.

wanderlust wrote:

Norpig wrote:An end to austerity, that made me laugh! Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of people struggling with Universal credit and using foodbanks.

They, along with the homeless and mental health sufferers don't exist in Toryland. The Police, Local Councils, NHS workers and Teachers are already lined up to be sacrificed next to keep their millionaire backers happy in their foreign homes.

Angry Dad wrote:

Natasha Whittam wrote:I agree that the budget doesn't go nearly far enough but no government, Tory or Labour, will ever be brave enough to make the tough decisions that actually make things fairer.

1) Stop making the NHS "free for everyone". Make all those people having treatment for conditions they brought on themselves PAY FOR THEIR FUCKING TREATMENT. If some obese person wants a gastric band, make them pay for it. If someone smoked 80 fags a day or drank 20 pints every night, don't be wasting resources on them. If they want help, make them pay. Also, while clearly not their own fault, couples who want IVF should be paying. Not having children is not a sickness or disease. There are people with cancer not getting the drugs they need because couples are getting £5,000 per cycle for IVF.

2) Stop paying for people to have children. Stop handing out child benefit, stop handing out free nursery places. We seem to have reached a situation where people have kids and then expect the taxpayer to pay for them. If you want a kid, then fucking pay for him or her.

These two obvious changes would transform the budget for the NHS, universal credit, mental health etc. I can't imagine any decent, sane person not agreeing with me. 25 stone Janice with 4 kids from Crawley, probably not so much.

I like it.

Don't disagree with some of your issues in point 1 - however I doubt making those changes would have a major impact on NHS finances.

However you're wrong on point 2 - there is a clear and negative impact in getting rid of child benefits, poverty affects education, chances of getting a job later in life and their health - all of which have a future impact on their likelihood to become a productive member of society and not be a drain on the state either through ill health or lack of productivity. You're not going to be able to limit the amount of children people have (look to China for reference).

T.R.O.Y wrote:

Angry Dad wrote:

Natasha Whittam wrote:I agree that the budget doesn't go nearly far enough but no government, Tory or Labour, will ever be brave enough to make the tough decisions that actually make things fairer.

1) Stop making the NHS "free for everyone". Make all those people having treatment for conditions they brought on themselves PAY FOR THEIR FUCKING TREATMENT. If some obese person wants a gastric band, make them pay for it. If someone smoked 80 fags a day or drank 20 pints every night, don't be wasting resources on them. If they want help, make them pay. Also, while clearly not their own fault, couples who want IVF should be paying. Not having children is not a sickness or disease. There are people with cancer not getting the drugs they need because couples are getting £5,000 per cycle for IVF.

2) Stop paying for people to have children. Stop handing out child benefit, stop handing out free nursery places. We seem to have reached a situation where people have kids and then expect the taxpayer to pay for them. If you want a kid, then fucking pay for him or her.

These two obvious changes would transform the budget for the NHS, universal credit, mental health etc. I can't imagine any decent, sane person not agreeing with me. 25 stone Janice with 4 kids from Crawley, probably not so much.

I like it.

Don't disagree with some of your issues in point 1 - however I doubt making those changes would have a major impact on NHS finances.

However you're wrong on point 2 - there is a clear and negative impact in getting rid of child benefits, poverty affects education, chances of getting a job later in life and their health - all of which have a future impact on their likelihood to become a productive member of society and not be a drain on the state either through ill health or lack of productivity. You're not going to be able to limit the amount of children people have (look to China for reference).

I have a lot of sympathy with point 1 but doubt that it would be practical to implement in full. Charging for IVF and non-medical plastic surgery might be possible but what politician would advocate it?

Far more practical would be either a revaluation of council tax bands so people in large houses paid a realistic amount or even better a mansion tax. Most rich people pay very little tax.

[size=17]British government debt has gone up, not down, despite the cuts, from 52.3% of GDP in 2009 to 85.6% this year.  Austerity has failed massively and this budget certainly doesn't even pretend to address the problem adequately. Police, schools and local councils have every right to be aggrieved when potholes are considered more important. 
Meanwhile we continue with HS2 and big spending on updating nuclear weapons. Notice....not a word on climate change issues. The Nasty Party ploughs on with making the wealthy richer whereas the poor are given paltry tax cuts. The bedroom tax was kinder than Universal Credit![/size]

T.R.O.Y wrote:Don't disagree with some of your issues in point 1 - however I doubt making those changes would have a major impact on NHS finances.

Obesity costs the NHS at least 6 billion quid a year. Smoking related illnesses cost the NHS 2.7 billion quid a year. Even IVF costs the NHS £400m per year. Those are massive figures....imagine an NHS with an extra 9 billion quid a year. Tell me that wouldn't make a huge difference to cancer patients and people with other serious illnesses.

T.R.O.Y wrote:However you're wrong on point 2 - there is a clear and negative impact in getting rid of child benefits, poverty affects education, chances of getting a job later in life and their health - all of which have a future impact on their likelihood to become a productive member of society and not be a drain on the state either through ill health or lack of productivity. You're not going to be able to limit the amount of children people have (look to China for reference).

Of course there are problems associated with such a radical plan. But if there was no state help for people who have kids it would certainly put some people off. We need to move away from a culture of hand outs. Help should be there for people who fall on hard times, not to help bring even more lives into an over populated world.

Fair enough but if those numbers are accurate it’s still less than 10% of the annual budget - but I take your point it would make a big difference.

You’ve missed my second point though, there’s a long term economic benefit of having a more equal society and supporting those in need, you shouldn’t consider it a drain.

T.R.O.Y wrote:You’ve missed my second point though, there’s a long term economic benefit of having a more equal society and supporting those in need, you shouldn’t consider it a drain.

I don't think it's a drain if people are genuinely deserving of help. But having a kid shouldn't automatically give you access to a range of benefits.

So Mary is 18, left home, nowhere to live so gets herself pregnant in order to get a flat and access to benefits. However, if there were no homes/benefits available to people who have a kid don't you think Mary would think twice before having a child?

No I think people are fucking idiots. But punishing their children is immoral and increases the likelihood of that child becoming a drain on the economy in future.

Once you start charging for services on the NHS it will start a slide to full blown privatisation which cannot be allowed to happen. In some areas IVF isn't allowed on the NHS already which is worse i think as penalises couples who live in the "wrong" areas.