Brexit negotiations

xmiles wrote:"Honouring the referendum vote" is an oxymoron. The leave campaign was the most dishonest and corrupt campaign in recent British history. There is no honour in ignoring this and refusing a second referendum on whatever deal is finally agreed in parliament.

Congratulations, that's the 1,000,000th time you've used that phrase in 3 years.

Talk about a very broken record....

More to the point, the referendum vote cannot and will not ever be "honoured" because what was promised is and always was unrealistic and undeliverable, and all the stamping of feet and demanding "I want my Unicorn" in the world won't change that.

Interesting article by the Daily Mail columnist Peter Oborne. He was a leading advocate of brexit but has now changed his mind and realised that leaving the EU will be a disaster. To give a couple of quotes:

Indirectly we will all be disadvantaged. The biggest and immediate losers, however, will be working-class people from England’s north-east, who are widely said to support Brexit. Some of them currently enjoy relatively well-paid and secure jobs thanks to foreign investment. A lot of those jobs will slowly vanish.

I can’t help noticing that those most vocal in advocating Brexit are two opposing camps. On the one hand traders in financial assets – in particular hedge-fund managers – relish the speculative opportunities created by Brexit volatility. The city state of Singapore is held up as one economic model. The United States is another. I cannot see that there is any popular desire for us to follow the business and employment cultures of such countries.

On the other side we have the far Left, which wants out of the European Union for the exact opposite reason. The Left sees the EU as a capitalist conspiracy because of the protections it offers for private property and the restraints against centralised economic power, in particular state aid. A very substantial faction around Jeremy Corbyn, including former members of the Communist Party, is looking forward to British departure from the EU because they rightly see that the EU prevents the imposition of socialism.

When hedge-fund managers and the Communist Party see eye-to-eye on any question, it’s time to be concerned.

A link to the full article below but I doubt many brexit fans on here will bother to read it.

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/i-was-strong-brexiteer-now-we-must-swallow-our-pride-and-think-again/

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

As always logic and facts are just to difficult for brexiteers to be able to handle. It might destroy their belief in magical thinking.

So I should read an article and change my mind about Brexit?

What a load of shite.

It's happening. Just accept it.

So what would make you change your mind?

xmiles wrote:So what would make you change your mind?

Nothing. Go and shove your articles up your arse and get over it!

karlypants wrote:

xmiles wrote:So what would make you change your mind?

Nothing. Go and shove your articles up your arse and get over it!

The article has big words in it so you would probably struggle to understand it.

xmiles wrote:

karlypants wrote:

xmiles wrote:So what would make you change your mind?

Nothing. Go and shove your articles up your arse and get over it!

The article has big words in it so you would probably struggle to understand it.

You keep thinking that if it makes you happy.

xmiles wrote:So what would make you change your mind?

Nothing.

No one knows the future. I firmly believe in the years to come it will turn out to be the best decision for the country.

xmiles wrote:Interesting article by the Daily Mail columnist Peter Oborne. He was a leading advocate of brexit but has now changed his mind and realised that leaving the EU will be a disaster. To give a couple of quotes:

Indirectly we will all be disadvantaged. The biggest and immediate losers, however, will be working-class people from England’s north-east, who are widely said to support Brexit. Some of them currently enjoy relatively well-paid and secure jobs thanks to foreign investment. A lot of those jobs will slowly vanish.

I can’t help noticing that those most vocal in advocating Brexit are two opposing camps. On the one hand traders in financial assets – in particular hedge-fund managers – relish the speculative opportunities created by Brexit volatility. The city state of Singapore is held up as one economic model. The United States is another. I cannot see that there is any popular desire for us to follow the business and employment cultures of such countries.

On the other side we have the far Left, which wants out of the European Union for the exact opposite reason. The Left sees the EU as a capitalist conspiracy because of the protections it offers for private property and the restraints against centralised economic power, in particular state aid. A very substantial faction around Jeremy Corbyn, including former members of the Communist Party, is looking forward to British departure from the EU because they rightly see that the EU prevents the imposition of socialism.

When hedge-fund managers and the Communist Party see eye-to-eye on any question, it’s time to be concerned.

A link to the full article below but I doubt many brexit fans on here will bother to read it.

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/i-was-strong-brexiteer-now-we-must-swallow-our-pride-and-think-again/

What a clown, how did he envisage this scenario unfolding? Complete idiocy.

".....Still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest......." Paul Simon. ("The Boxer")

No one likes to be proved wrong and most prefer to close their minds to alternative views, often resorting to abuse and petulance rather than using cold reason or convincing experience in their arguments. But there can be no certainty here.

As Nat says, no one knows for sure how things will pan out. We either have trust or we don't.....much like faith in God. 

In retrospect, the only sane thing to do in 2016 was to abstain because we had no idea what would be the right path based on the contradictions we were being fed.   I'm pretty sure that would also be the case if we had a second referendum now.

It would be great to be able to trust our elected politicians to be able to negotiate successfully and to do what is right, but they have proved themselves no wiser or more honest or any more able than the rest of us.

Brexiteers strong fearless adventurers, Remainers cowards pussies.

Angry Dad wrote:Brexiteers weak workshy backward-looking parochial chickens frightened of foreigners and their own shadow, Remainers brave forward-looking pioneers prepared to take on the difficult job of building a new fairer and united world.

That's more like it.

wanderlust wrote:

Angry Dad wrote:Brexiteers weak workshy backward-looking parochial chickens frightened of foreigners and their own shadow, Remainers brave forward-looking pioneers prepared to take on the difficult job of building a new fairer and united world.

That's more like it.

Around 75% of MP's wanted to remain, how did anyone expect them to manage the exit?

No religion to my name, my politics are what suits me at the time no affiliation to any party.

I work in what many would say is a high tech industry, and for me and my work to exit would be a disaster as the company I work for would certainly relocate and that would move me even further from my beloved Wanderers.
Although if Parkinson remains in the job then that is no hardship.

She will be gone by the end of the month if not next week. Both main parties are finished there's a new guy in town.

Who's that then?

Mr Bean.