Do You Actually Want To Get Promoted?

bwfc1874 wrote:

bwfc71 wrote:

MartinBWFC wrote:Going up will instantly help towards the debt, stay up, and we will be financially viable again, come straight down, and we be far healthier financially than we are now, so who in their right mind would not want us to go up, oh hang on.

We got into the debt because of our presence in the Premiership!

As soon as a club has gained promotion to a higher division they are automatically faced with paying higher prices for players, higher wages, higher fees etc etc etc.

I am NOT saying that we shouldn't go up, as I do want to see success but at what cost? Yes if we get promoted the money is good but it won't clear our debt, in fact it could actually compound the debt, when strengthening the squad - its a double edged sword when it comes to the finances.

Nonsense, we got into debt because we spent money very poorly and gave out a load of big contracts to players with no sell on value who weren't good enough.

Look at the players we've made a profit on in the last 10 years, barely any. When a club like ours spend huge money on a player it either needs to give us a good return in terms of success and/or a fee for his eventual sale.

We got Elmander, who was shit and went for nothing. The money for his move was a result of Anelka a good example of spending money although I think we could have got more for him than we did.

It only compounds the debts if you're not smart about it.

Is not nonsense at all - Megson brought in players on high wages and which other premiership wouldn't touch. As OC pointed out, yesterday on Soccer AM, we released 11 players whose combined annual wages equated to £18million. He couldn't sell them as other Premiership teams saw them as not good enough whilst Championship clubs were outrpiced.

We already had a £30million debt after we moved into the Reebok, due to teh rebuilding and relocation. But since then our debt has risen and risen to what it was at the end of the last financial year - being approximately £130million!

You ask any club and they will say that the move into a higher division does create more cost for the club. PLayers do become more expensive to either buy or loan and the higher division does mean higher fees.

The best thing to do is look at the costs for clubs for those gaining promotion last season, from any division to next higher one, and see what teh cost was season before - and its not just about inflation either.

If we do get promotion, we will be going into the Premier League with debts fo around £120million - after one season in the division I expect the debt to be about £130million even with taking into account the TV money, the position money and parachute money. Remeber we do not get teh parachute money in one go it is taken over 4 years and if promotion is gained during that time, back into the Premier League, then the parachute money stops - therefore if we get promotion this season then we only have received one amount of the money and won't receive any more!!! Therefore the only figure to look at, with promotion in mind, is the TV & position money - parachute money is just an afterthough added bonus for if we are unforunate to get relegation.

bwfc71 wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:

bwfc71 wrote:

MartinBWFC wrote:Going up will instantly help towards the debt, stay up, and we will be financially viable again, come straight down, and we be far healthier financially than we are now, so who in their right mind would not want us to go up, oh hang on.

We got into the debt because of our presence in the Premiership!

As soon as a club has gained promotion to a higher division they are automatically faced with paying higher prices for players, higher wages, higher fees etc etc etc.

I am NOT saying that we shouldn't go up, as I do want to see success but at what cost? Yes if we get promoted the money is good but it won't clear our debt, in fact it could actually compound the debt, when strengthening the squad - its a double edged sword when it comes to the finances.

Nonsense, we got into debt because we spent money very poorly and gave out a load of big contracts to players with no sell on value who weren't good enough.

Look at the players we've made a profit on in the last 10 years, barely any. When a club like ours spend huge money on a player it either needs to give us a good return in terms of success and/or a fee for his eventual sale.

We got Elmander, who was shit and went for nothing. The money for his move was a result of Anelka a good example of spending money although I think we could have got more for him than we did.

It only compounds the debts if you're not smart about it.

Is not nonsense at all - Megson brought in players on high wages and which other premiership wouldn't touch. As OC pointed out, yesterday on Soccer AM, we released 11 players whose combined annual wages equated to £18million. He couldn't sell them as other Premiership teams saw them as not good enough whilst Championship clubs were outrpiced.

We already had a £30million debt after we moved into the Reebok, due to teh rebuilding and relocation. But since then our debt has risen and risen to what it was at the end of the last financial year - being approximately £130million!

You ask any club and they will say that the move into a higher division does create more cost for the club. PLayers do become more expensive to either buy or loan and the higher division does mean higher fees.

The best thing to do is look at the costs for clubs for those gaining promotion last season, from any division to next higher one, and see what teh cost was season before - and its not just about inflation either.

If we do get promotion, we will be going into the Premier League with debts fo around £120million - after one season in the division I expect the debt to be about £130million even with taking into account the TV money, the position money and parachute money. Remeber we do not get teh parachute money in one go it is taken over 4 years and if promotion is gained during that time, back into the Premier League, then the parachute money stops - therefore if we get promotion this season then we only have received one amount of the money and won't receive any more!!! Therefore the only figure to look at, with promotion in mind, is the TV & position money - parachute money is just an afterthough added bonus for if we are unforunate to get relegation.

All you've done is completely ignore what i wrote. Megson spent a lot of money on players who didn't improve our position enough and didn't have a sell on value.

OC did the same thing to a lesser extent bringing in some very average players.

That's why we're in debt.

We've more than halved our wage bill since relegation and IMO have improved the squad, that's because we're not giving inflated wages to average players continue to do that and we'll be profitable.

Whatever division we're in there are bound to be a lot of changes in personnel during the summer. Stay in the Championship and we'll be focused on cheap and cheerful prospects again. Get promoted and we'll be dealing with a different class of player. Even if we get pumped every week in the prem it will be good for the bank balance and we can revive the chant "here for your money, we're only here for your money" etc.
First things first though - it's a huge ask to get promoted from this position. Staying in the playoff positions is going to be tougher than some think and then having to beat the likes of Brighton and Watford to get up? Not easy. But if we make it we'll have deserved it.

wanderingstar606 wrote: I want to see us promoted purely for financial reasons...

Just wanted to greet you 'Wandering' and bid you hello and welcome.

I've noticed you've viewed us regularly so I'm really pleased that you've decided now to dip your toe in the water and to make a few posts.

Hope to read loads more of your views and comments now that you've decided to join in.

Will you be going to Wembley if we when we get there in a few weeks?

Fat Sam laid the foundations for our debt by buying too many short-term older players. Campo, Youri, Okocha, Stelios, Hiero, Diouf etc were all on HUGE wages and all left for nothing as far as I can remember.

Megson compounded the problem by buying absolute shite for lots of money on big wages.

If we manage to fluke a Premier League place next season the temptation will be to buy over-the-hill but proven PL players, rather than seek out good young players from the lower leagues like Reading, Norwich & Southampton have done. Reading will be back in the Championship next season, but I'll bet they've turned a profit during their short stay in the PL.

Apart from the financial benefits of it ...
Wouldn't be grand to see Zat hacking down Van Persie in the penalty box and Medo seeing red for upending Saurez.....imagine the fun posts we can have on here.....looking forward to it already.
I know some would prefer Barnsley away on a Tuesday night.....not me...bring on City for a Tom Eaves hatrick !!!

Natasha Whittam wrote:

If we manage to fluke a Premier League place next season the temptation will be to buy over-the-hill but proven PL players, rather than seek out good young players from the lower leagues like Reading, Norwich & Southampton have done.

I seriously doubt that having seen Dougie's transfer dealings so far, young 'hungry' players seem to be the targets.

I demand you applaud Dougie's transfer policy.

bwfc1874 wrote:

I demand you applaud Dougie's transfer policy.

Who has he signed who has been good? Loans don't count.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:

I demand you applaud Dougie's transfer policy.

Who has he signed who has been good? Loans don't count.

Medo

bwfc1874 wrote:

Medo

So one player? We'll need more than one good player whatever division we are in next season.

Craig Davies is good for £300,000.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:

Medo

So one player? We'll need more than one good player whatever division we are in next season.

Has he made a bad signing yet? (loans don't count)

Freedman is the Steven hawking of management .

scottjames30 wrote:Freedman is the Steven hawking of management .

I find it much more boring expecting to win every game to be honest.

Id much rather wait for that 1 win in 7 games against United than win 5 and draw 2 against Barnsley.

Have you been as satisfied by any game we have won this season as after beating Liverpool last season? I haven't.

As much as I would love it, we won't go up this season, Coyle saw to that, I do think we can give it a decent go next season, and depending on who stays at Wigan, QPR, and Reading we may nick an automatic spot, but realistically playoffs.

Why do loans not count? They play for the team don't they? We don't get to pay a transfer fee and we don't get to keep them, but they still represent the club and that's what matters as far as events on the pitch are concerned.
I think you're confusing two distinct issues in order to make a spurious point. On the one hand, loanees are a stopgap measure and it can be argued that their presence retards the development of the squad for the longer term. On the other hand it would be rash to invest in permanent signings when we still don't know what division we'll be in next season, let alone the one after that - especially given our financial position.
There was never a chance that Dougie would splash the cash on expensive signings in the January transfer window, so the man's ability in the transfer market should be assessed on what he's done - not on what he was never likely to do in the first place.

Dougie is the sort of manager that can pick up diamonds for nothing he seems to see what others don't example Glen Murray from Brighton.Medo,Craig Davies for £300-000 .Natasha chats shit.Stay down.Just the financial incentive alone should rest the argument.We will need to sign players and we will lose and be battling relegation.But I'd rather be in the Premiership than the Championship.Natasha slagging SA for finishing 6th,7th,7th and 8th over 4seasons. What a tit he brought some of the best players JJ for example who was a absolute delight to watch Youri D etc.I stood in the Allianz Arena watching a Wanderers side get a 2-2 draw with Bayern Munichwho would of ever dreamt of that in the mid 80's.Anyone who thinks we should stay down stay away.Your negativity is not required.

bwfc1874 wrote:

Natasha Whittam wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:

Medo

So one player? We'll need more than one good player whatever division we are in next season.

Has he made a bad signing yet? (loans don't count)

Yet to answer this Nat.

Born to be a wanderer wrote:Natasha slagging SA for finishing 6th,7th,7th and 8th over 4seasons. What a tit he brought some of the best players JJ for example who was a absolute delight to watch Youri D etc.

I wasn't slagging him as such, but he wasn't thinking about the future of BWFC when he bought all these older players to the club on massive wages.

Put it this way, would you rather have great sex once and never have sex again, or good sex for the rest of your life?