Should Freedman get the sack?

Of course it's bollocks, have you seen who has so called started this rumour?

A few of the youth academy players. Some fans on there really do talk some shit.

......anyway i've put £10 on is just in case.

Culcheth_White wrote:

scottjames30 wrote:If freedman goes, all his staff go with him, fresh start IMO .

I don't go on facebook very often, but I've just been looking at one of the Bolton Wanderers fans fans groups and there seems to be one particular rumour that if we lose to Bournemouth on Saturday, Dougie will be sacked and Jimmy Phillips will be brought in until the end of the season.

It's probably a load of bollocks!  

It's certainly a massive game. If we lose at home to Bournemouth then I don't see how the board have much option other than to put Jimmy and Little Sam back in charge on a caretaker basis.

Michael Laudrup?

(just for the Nebula   )

I also suspect another loss would mean the end for Douglas

Sammy Lee is wasted at our club at the moment IMO, probably one of the finest assistant managers in england.

As for Phillips, he'd certainly have the respect of the younger players and knows the club inside out.

Remit for new manager. 

Must have 

A) Played for the club. 

B) see A. 

C) see B. 

The end.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:Remit for new manager. 

Must have 

A) Played for the club. 

B) see A. 

C) see B. 

The end.

That only leaves Phil Brown. No thanks.

Reebok Trotter wrote:

Hipster_Nebula wrote:Remit for new manager. 

Must have 

A) Played for the club. 

B) see A. 

C) see B. 

The end.

That only leaves Phil Brown. No thanks.

Him and Peter Reid will be mentioned frequently if Dougie was to go, trust me, they both were when Coyle left.

If Dougie were to go then I would prefer somebody like Nigel Clough. I thought he did a decent job at Derby with limited funds and he provided the platform for McLaren to look good again.

I see his Blades are now into extra time at Craven Cottage.

Presumably, it wouldn't cost us anything to promote JP to head coach or to stick him back in his old role if it didn't work out.

When you think how much we've spent in recent years firing and hiring, not just managers but the useless cronies they insisted on bringing with them, I can understand the appeal, even though I'm far from crazy about the idea myself.

doffcocker wrote:Presumably, it wouldn't cost us anything to promote JP to head coach or to stick him back in his old role if it didn't work out.

Would you do your bosses job PLUS your own for the same pay as you are on now?

Of course it will cost money to move people about, even if it is just within the club.

Not to mention whether or not Freedman's staff want to work with the new 'boss' - in which case pay off's or possible constructive dismissal claims and employment tribunals may result.

It's easy to say such an internal promotion would not cost anything - you're certainly not the only one to suggest it - but in reality all sorts of financial costs and employment rights would occur.

It won't happen even if we do lose on Saturday, which I don't actually think we will. Freedman's had a tough job to do all in all even though he has made heavy work of it but given the financial situation and the fact there are still players who can't wait to move I think they'll give him to the end of the season and see about it then. That's assuming we do pick up a few points in our run of home games. A couple of early defeats and all bets are off as we definately can not stand another relegation.

Sluffy wrote:
Not to mention whether or not Freedman's staff want to work with the new 'boss' - in which case pay off's or possible constructive dismissal claims and employment tribunals may result.

Do you believe that for Freedman to be club manager is part of Lawrence, Fleming, et al's terms of employment?

doffcocker wrote:

Sluffy wrote:
Not to mention whether or not Freedman's staff want to work with the new 'boss' - in which case pay off's or possible constructive dismissal claims and employment tribunals may result.

Do you believe that for Freedman to be club manager is part of Lawrence, Fleming, et al's terms of employment?

I don't know, I'm not party to their contractual terms and conditions but I'd be very surprised if there wasn't something in their contracts regarding a change in manager.

After all many of them would have left well paid jobs to work with Freedman, and relocated themselves and their family's some distance from where they lived before.

They would also be on considerably higher salaries than most of us I would imagine and I would think they would have taken excellent legal advice as to what should be in their contracts before they signed them in respect of what after all is a common football occurance - namely the sacking (or removal from office) of the person who basically they changed their jobs for.

It's a common sense precaution really, otherwise you could leave your present job, good salary and move your home and your family, to go and work with someone you know, only to find that everything could change in a way you would not want them too, well before the expiry period of the contract that you have signed.

Wouldn't you want to protect yourself too under similar circumstances?  I know I would.

Sluffy wrote:
Wouldn't you want to protect yourself too under similar circumstances?  I know I would.

I don't believe Freedman was the main attraction for Lawrence and Fleming but I agree with what you're saying anyway.

To come back to Phillips, what would happen with Freedman and his staff and who would be put in his/their position(s) are two separate matters here.
The subject seemed to be coming round to the latter. I don't know how it's dealt with contractually when somebody internal is given a temporary role.
I'm guessing that when Phillips was manager for three matches last season, it cost the club a minimal amount, given that he was unproven, therefore not in a position to demand a substantial pay rise and a person that would give his right arm for the job anyway.
Whichever way you look at it, putting Phillips in there for a trial period is a potentially big money saving alternative to bringing in somebody on the basis that they'd, to quote CD, "done well with another club for a split second."

If Freeman had not been appointed Bolton boss, do you think Lawrence and Flemming would be here now? Of course the only reason they are now here is because Freedman ask them to become part of his team at Bolton and an agreeable finacial package aranged between themselves and the club.

I'm as sure there would be financially agreeable breaks in the contract for both sides also if Freedman was to leave as the Bolton boss for whatever reason.

Not everyone wants or seeks out to be a manager - Phillips may be one of them for all we know. He's not been linked to any managerial job elsewhere for instance.

I don't believe in the football world of huge money and relatively short stays of employment in a position, that many staff appointments done at clubs like Bolton (ex-Premier club, aiming to get back there before the parachute payments end) are done on the cheap. It's simply the wrong type of organisational culture for that to happen imo.

Even if he was appointed there's no guarantee it will work out - look at what happened when we did it the last time with Sammy Lee.

Whoever gets the job if Freedman was to go soon, as a very difficult job to do imo, for the reasons I give earlier in this thread.

I think the discussion should shift on to who should be the assistant manager. We have LSL, who although his tenure was awful as our manager, he has been the No2 for great managers like Benetez, Big Sam and even Sven with England. We have a coach with all that experience on our books and we are paying him to babysit the kids!

I think one of the real major problems with the current set up is LL and the other coaches are failing on the training pitch as this is evident in the performances on the pitch on match day. This was a similar situation to what we had under Coyle. A figure-head who wants to play football the right way and a failing backroom team. IMO the club should do exactly the same as they did with Coyle and let DF know that we need to have a shift around with the coaching set up and look to promote our own coaches like Dave Lee, Tony Kelly and especially LSL to prominent roles within the first team set up. Tottenham have done exactly this and they are currently holding their own in the Premier League - what experience did they have before? None. They were looking after the U21s.

A bigger question to ask is what precedence does a manager like DF have for dictating how our club coaches our players. You would answer as he is the manager, but his chosen team are failing in every way, so that decision should be taken out of his hands like the club did with Coyle.

I only think getting rid of DF will work because we'll be changing the coaching set up. What I'm trying to get at is, we could replace DF with Jimmy Philips, but if you kept LL and the other coaches, JP will be just as crap as DF because its the coaches that are really failing. We could theoretically change the coaching set up and keep DF in charge which could see a change on the training pitch and this could transpose to the pitch on match day.

I was talking to someone who claims to be itk and he reckons Dougie does very little coaching but spends the bulk of his time in his office on the phone wheeling and dealing. I can't see it myself but you never know.

Reebok Trotter wrote:I was talking to someone who claims to be itk and he reckons Dougie does very little coaching but spends the bulk of his time in his office on the phone wheeling and dealing. I can't see it myself but you never know.

Something along these lines was it.

DF is a man in a shiny suit with a face for the camera. While at Palace TP knew he was the brains and did all the work with the team. TP being offered the chance to develop himself at his own speed hopped off hand in hand with skippy leaving DF to sink all alone.
As the results are read over the wireless "What's that skip" Dougie is for the sack sounds of TP laughing can be heard across the outback.



Did your itk friend tell you it was made clear to PG from he start that TP was off on his own. Yet gave DF the job knowing TP would never be in the setup. Funny thing is PG claims he tried desperately to get TP to come.

This reminds me of the Palace fan timeline when dougie was linked with us 

"haha lik fuk you'll get freedman u cnuts"

"Lennie is the brains anyway" 

"Greedman"

"Tony Popovich was the brains anyway"