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Brexit negotiations
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22 Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:43 pm
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
xmiles wrote:Particularly when you have a terrible hand.
No, particularly when you have a brilliant hand, or else people will fold.
23 Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:07 pm
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
OK I'm waiting for the EU negotiators to fold but I'm not holding my breath.
How big do you think the brexit divorce bill is going to be? We are not going to get anywhere until that issue is resolved.
How big do you think the brexit divorce bill is going to be? We are not going to get anywhere until that issue is resolved.
24 Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:12 pm
Leeds_Trotter
El Hadji Diouf
I voted remain but I'm getting sick of hearing all about it now. We should just tell them to fuck off and not give them a penny. They can shove everything up their arse. If they have a problem with that, just tell them to bring it on. We've won 2 world wars, we can win a 3rd. 
25 Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:49 pm
gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
Even my optimism is a little dented when I see that we are appearing to be absolutely clueless. I hope Nat is right, and its a tactic, although its a strange one if it is.
26 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Jul 23, 2017 12:52 pm
bwfc71
Ivan Campo
Leeds_Trotter wrote:I voted remain but I'm getting sick of hearing all about it now. We should just tell them to fuck off and not give them a penny. They can shove everything up their arse. If they have a problem with that, just tell them to bring it on. We've won 2 world wars, we can win a 3rd.
Interjection time......
UK did not win 2 World wars, but the allies won 2 World wars and they were helped by many behind the "enemy" lines such as 5th columnists and resistance groups. In other words our European bretheren helped us win the wars!
But if we were to go to war now, where are our ships, where are our fighter planes, where are our soldiers, where is our arsenal (not the football team) all reduced by successive Governments as a cost-saving measure.
In regards to the divorce settlement, just like any divorce settlement it will take time and it is going to cost. Unfortunately the UK are delusional in thinking we can get our way, no matter what. It is one country of 60 million against 27 other countries of over 500 million - of course we are going to end up with a worse deal than what we currently have, but the way David Davis is conducting himself, its like watching aa very bad ITV sitcom.
UK is fast becoming aa laughing stock with the rest of the world, with regards to Brexit, and they all know when we leave we will be desperate for trade deals, and they will get the best deal for them which will mean it wont be good for us. Look at Australia and India any Trade deal will have to include weakened immigration - something that people voted against!!!
Whilst the US will look to strengthen their own coffers from any deal with UK, whilst having a heavy fist over what Westminster does (worse than what we currently have with Brussels)
27 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Jul 23, 2017 4:53 pm
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
bwfc71 wrote:Leeds_Trotter wrote:I voted remain but I'm getting sick of hearing all about it now. We should just tell them to fuck off and not give them a penny. They can shove everything up their arse. If they have a problem with that, just tell them to bring it on. We've won 2 world wars, we can win a 3rd.
Interjection time......
UK did not win 2 World wars, but the allies won 2 World wars and they were helped by many behind the "enemy" lines such as 5th columnists and resistance groups. In other words our European bretheren helped us win the wars!
But if we were to go to war now, where are our ships, where are our fighter planes, where are our soldiers, where is our arsenal (not the football team) all reduced by successive Governments as a cost-saving measure.
In regards to the divorce settlement, just like any divorce settlement it will take time and it is going to cost. Unfortunately the UK are delusional in thinking we can get our way, no matter what. It is one country of 60 million against 27 other countries of over 500 million - of course we are going to end up with a worse deal than what we currently have, but the way David Davis is conducting himself, its like watching aa very bad ITV sitcom.
UK is fast becoming aa laughing stock with the rest of the world, with regards to Brexit, and they all know when we leave we will be desperate for trade deals, and they will get the best deal for them which will mean it wont be good for us. Look at Australia and India any Trade deal will have to include weakened immigration - something that people voted against!!!
Whilst the US will look to strengthen their own coffers from any deal with UK, whilst having a heavy fist over what Westminster does (worse than what we currently have with Brussels)
Exactly. It is depressing how delusional some brexit fans are about the political realities of negotiating from a weak position. The EU won't be doing us any favours as they don't want other countries to think about leaving. The Americans, especially under Trump, always put themselves first and never do us any favours. Other countries like China and India will know we are desparate and will take advantage of this.
28 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Jul 23, 2017 11:02 pm
gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
One of the main reasons that we will have a large divorce bill is because we, as a country, have always played by the rules, even to our detriment. The main European players have rarely followed all the rules, preferring to cherry pick what is best for them. As we are also a nation that sticks by its word and commitments, we will be called upon to pay up, probably for far more than we would have received had we remained within the EU. however you look at it, were screwed, and no amount of negotiating will stop 27 countries baying for blood, sensing that we are stupid enough to pay up.
29 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Jul 23, 2017 11:02 pm
gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
sorry, should have said 'paid' rather than 'received' in line 4
30 Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:11 am
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
The £ multi billion payment to the EU will only be a small part of the actual cost of leaving the EU though. When you look at the cost of effectively hamstringing Government with mountains of replacement legislation for the next 5 years, the cost to industry as uncertainty and increased supplier costs take their toll, the loss of competitive advantage that has already - in a matter of months - allowed France to overtake the UK as the world's 5th strongest economy and the (at best) transitional costs of replacing foreign labour with our own workforce (if unemployed Brits are ever willing/able to take on those tougher/lower paid roles) the real cost must be approaching £ trillions rather than the billions they flippantly quote in the media.
And it won't be the international corporations that are behind Brexit who will suffer.
And it won't be the international corporations that are behind Brexit who will suffer.
31 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:04 pm
gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
Some truth in that. Trying to remain optimistic, I would compare the current shenanigans with the reshaping and changing of direction of a football team.
Its realised that things may be ok at the time, but the future is not so rosy. With this in mind, change is called for. It all goes to cock in the beginning, but slowly, (very bloody slowly), plans, ideas, and processes are utilised, and a clearer future is mapped. Unfortunately we have a team with a limited skill set, but they have to go forward, whatever the predictions. The plan could still crash and burn, with the result nowhere what was hoped for, however, getting the stakeholders/fans on board, and in a positive manner may help. it'll be a long slog, but our future is in our own hands. (lets hope we don't get rid of any assets too soon).
Its realised that things may be ok at the time, but the future is not so rosy. With this in mind, change is called for. It all goes to cock in the beginning, but slowly, (very bloody slowly), plans, ideas, and processes are utilised, and a clearer future is mapped. Unfortunately we have a team with a limited skill set, but they have to go forward, whatever the predictions. The plan could still crash and burn, with the result nowhere what was hoped for, however, getting the stakeholders/fans on board, and in a positive manner may help. it'll be a long slog, but our future is in our own hands. (lets hope we don't get rid of any assets too soon).
32 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:30 pm
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
I think the point of Brexit negotiations is that our future is NOT in our own hands for the first time since the Norman invasion. Our future will be determined by the outcome of the negotiations with multiple parties who will put their own interests first.gloswhite wrote:Some truth in that. Trying to remain optimistic, I would compare the current shenanigans with the reshaping and changing of direction of a football team.
Its realised that things may be ok at the time, but the future is not so rosy. With this in mind, change is called for. It all goes to cock in the beginning, but slowly, (very bloody slowly), plans, ideas, and processes are utilised, and a clearer future is mapped. Unfortunately we have a team with a limited skill set, but they have to go forward, whatever the predictions. The plan could still crash and burn, with the result nowhere what was hoped for, however, getting the stakeholders/fans on board, and in a positive manner may help. it'll be a long slog, but our future is in our own hands. (lets hope we don't get rid of any assets too soon).
When we joined the EU we controlled our own destiny because we could always walk away if we didn't like the deal on offer.
But now May has made it clear that there's no turning back - so now we can't walk away, we have to get a deal and the people we are negotiating with know it.
Brexit is a loss of control, not gaining control.
33 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:32 pm
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
In 20 years we will laugh at your posts (even more than we do now).
This isn't a short term thing, in a couple of decades things will look very different. Greatness doesn't come easily or quickly.
This isn't a short term thing, in a couple of decades things will look very different. Greatness doesn't come easily or quickly.
34 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:53 pm
wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
No but it only takes a concerted media campaign, an incompetent government and a referendum to lose it.Natasha Whittam wrote:Greatness doesn't come easily or quickly.
35 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:11 pm
gloswhite
Guðni Bergsson
And a country half full of pessimists, who are determined that everything will go wrong, and, for whatever reason, refuse to consider any positive way forward.
36 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:25 pm
karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Posts : 38249
Join date : 2012-08-04
gloswhite wrote:And a country half full of pessimists, who are determined that everything will go wrong, and, for whatever reason, refuse to consider any positive way forward.
37 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:39 pm
Sluffy
Admin
karlypants wrote:gloswhite wrote:And a country half full of pessimists, who are determined that everything will go wrong, and, for whatever reason, refuse to consider any positive way forward.
+1
38 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:56 pm
Soul Kitchen
Ivan Campo
A pessimist is never disappointed, but Brexit fans could be!gloswhite wrote:And a country half full of pessimists, who are determined that everything will go wrong, and, for whatever reason, refuse to consider any positive way forward.
39 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:00 pm
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
gloswhite wrote:And a country half full of pessimists, who are determined that everything will go wrong, and, for whatever reason, refuse to consider any positive way forward.
You are confusing pessimism with realism.
There is no way we are going to be better off out of the EU than in it.
40 Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:25 pm
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
xmiles wrote:There is no way we are going to be better off out of the EU than in it.
Meet me here in 20 years and we'll see who was right.
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