UK unemployment down 55,000.
Once again the Tory government proves it knows what it's doing.
Once again the Tory government proves it knows what it's doing.
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I don't think anybody is questioning whether they know what they are doing or not. It's what they are (knowingly) doing that is the problem.Natasha Whittam wrote:UK unemployment down 55,000.
Once again the Tory government proves it knows what it's doing.
Natasha Whittam wrote:okocha wrote:Under the Tories, austerity policies have wrecked the police, schools, prisons, social services, health and welfare etc. and the current chequers idea proposed for Brexit is certain to be disastrous for jobs and wealth.
They only had to do that because of the mess the previous government made.
In an age where everyone who voted leave the EU is either changing their mind or trying to ignore or even suppress anything that casts doubt on the wisdom of that decision as the facts start to emerge - including former leaders of that bandwagon - it's important that we don't lose the opportunity to avoid completely effing up the country irreversibly. But to be fair to you, at least you've made some effort to make a token defence of the referendum, albeit being predominantly based on the price of Twirls.Natasha Whittam wrote:It hasn't been debate and discussion. It's been you and xmiles ranting about Armageddon.
No one else is that bothered. If Brexit is the worst thing in your life, you've got a great life.
wanderlust wrote:...and contentious as it is, this thread has generated more debate and discussion than all but one (the Joke thread FFS) of the sticky threads in Wandering Minds so how come it hasn't been made into a sticky? Is it because Operation Ostrich is manifesting itself everywhere and the pro-Brexit mods are just hoping it will just go away despite the news telling us about the fallout on a daily basis?
Just a thought.
Sluffy wrote:Ever get sick of being an obnoxiously self important, self opinionated 'know it all'?
Just a thought.
Key point this. I suspect the answer is that the referendum showed poilticians of all parties how out of touch they re with sections of the communities they represent and that their number one priority is to try to gain/maintain control of power and are therefore prepared to jump on any bandwagon that is passing by to do it. Add to that the media's obsession that anyone who doesn't toe the party line on any single issue is labelled a "rebel" despite the fact that it is only logical that nobody is likely to agree with everything the party promotes. Use of the whip is becoming the norm rather than the exception.okocha wrote:
I've never understood why there has to be a party line on something that is so critical for the future of the country. Party politics and allegiance to Tory, Lab or Lib leaders shouldn't be an issue here.
wanderlust wrote:Sluffy wrote:Ever get sick of being an obnoxiously self important, self opinionated 'know it all'?
Just a thought.
wanderlust wrote:Key point this. I suspect the answer is that the referendum showed poilticians of all parties how out of touch they re with sections of the communities they represent and that their number one priority is to try to gain/maintain control of power and are therefore prepared to jump on any bandwagon that is passing by to do it. Add to that the media's obsession that anyone who doesn't toe the party line on any single issue is labelled a "rebel" despite the fact that it is only logical that nobody is likely to agree with everything the party promotes. Use of the whip is becoming the norm rather than the exception.okocha wrote:
I've never understood why there has to be a party line on something that is so critical for the future of the country. Party politics and allegiance to Tory, Lab or Lib leaders shouldn't be an issue here.
boltonbonce wrote:wanderlust wrote:Sluffy wrote:Ever get sick of being an obnoxiously self important, self opinionated 'know it all'?
Just a thought.
Sluffy wrote:wanderlust wrote:Key point this. I suspect the answer is that the referendum showed poilticians of all parties how out of touch they re with sections of the communities they represent and that their number one priority is to try to gain/maintain control of power and are therefore prepared to jump on any bandwagon that is passing by to do it. Add to that the media's obsession that anyone who doesn't toe the party line on any single issue is labelled a "rebel" despite the fact that it is only logical that nobody is likely to agree with everything the party promotes. Use of the whip is becoming the norm rather than the exception.okocha wrote:
I've never understood why there has to be a party line on something that is so critical for the future of the country. Party politics and allegiance to Tory, Lab or Lib leaders shouldn't be an issue here.
I thought the point was that the vast amount of Parliamentary constituencies throughout the country voted Leave and that is the mandate that the main political parties who govern our country are working to.
Obviously those not working to it can fairly be categorised as 'rebelling'.
Until the mandate changes then it is right and proper to seek Brexit.
The mandate is just over two years old, so is clearly in political terms considered current, for instance MP's and MEP's are elected for five year terms, before they are put to the next public vote.
Fwiw I believe there's been a significant change in the mood of the country regarding Brexit and I would support a second referendum on whether we agree to the final terms negotiated for Brexit or whether we would now rather remain but to suggest that the government and the main opposition party should 'rebel' against implementing Brexit based on the mandate issued to it from the country shows a total ignorance as to how this country is governed in terms of both law and custom.
Perhaps they should have clarified what it means before the referendum and then we wouldn't have to worry about our kid's future?T.R.O.Y wrote:I’d also support a referendum on the final deal, but mainly because of the lack of information provided as to what a leave deal would look like at the time of the vote. To the point where leaving the single market (which was never on the table) now looks a certainty.
The whole notion of ‘we voted leave, so leave’ is an over simplification, it’s far more complex than that and what one group would say is leaving another says is not.
Clarify what it means then let the people decide.
wanderlust wrote:Perhaps they should have clarified what it means before the referendum and then we wouldn't have to worry about our kid's future?
xmiles wrote:MPs are not bound by how their constituencies voted on brexit. It was a referendum which was meant to advise parliament but in no sense does it bind the MPs to vote the way their constituents voted.
MPs often ignore what their constituents want. The most obvious example would be the free votes held in the past on the death penalty.
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