Whitesince63 wrote:because I know how much worse Labour would be.
You always spoil your posts with nonsense like this.
You don't know. I don't know. I doubt even Starmer knows.
But to be worse than Liz Truss would be spectacular.
Whitesince63 wrote:because I know how much worse Labour would be.
Sluffy, on your high horse again. Just for once would you actually read a post before you make inaccurate comments deriding it? I agreed it was a car crash but the elements she proposed in her leadership campaign were agreed by virtually everyone and if she’d stuck to them, as Sunak is now doing, there wouldn’t have been any issue. She didn’t, she went far too far but even then, to sack Kwasi rather than just roll back on the proposals was wrong and she should have fallen on her sword.Sluffy wrote:Well all I can say is that if you do still think that Truss and Kwarty's (UNFUNDED) mini budget would have worked if they had prepared the ground for it better, then you are easily fooled.
May I remind you that Truss herself sacked Kwarty (who at the end of the day was carrying out HER financial polices) and replaced him by Hunt who DUMPED practically all of them and she still tried to cling on to being PM until the fiasco of the Fracking vote made her stay completely untenable.
Shows what sort of a person you voted in as PM and what grasp of government finances she had.
So I therefore stand by what I say, namely if you believe her financial policies were right, when even SHE DIDN'T and had to throw Kwarty under the bus and bring in Hunt to junk almost entirely ALL of HER OWN financial polices she was apparently so 'committed' to - whilst remember SHE WAS STILL IN OFFICE AS THE PRIME MINISTER - then yes I must know far more about government finances than you do considering I posted on here long before she won the race to be PM, that they would not work (and the fact Truss did the U turn WHILST Still IN OFFICE, or in other words, even SHE realised they would not work) and that the fact that even AFTER that you still stick by your belief that they would have done, shows that you do live in some sort of political rhetoric wonderland and NOT the real world.
I am NOT insulting or abusing you but rather stating the blindingly obvious truth of the matter, which apparently you are seemingly blissfully unaware of yourself.
Truss rejected her own financial policies whilst still as the PM, ffs!!!
Doesn't even that give you a hint they were wrong?
All the 'we should have prepared the ground better' is just claptrap to feed to the masses to believe - it simply isn't true.
The fatal flaw was the mini budget was UNFUNDED and they could have prepared the ground in advance as much as they liked but it wouldn't have made any ha'pence of difference because it still would have been UNFUNDED.
Even your dreaded enemy the Labour Government would never put a budget before Parliament that wasn't funded - yet you think they would do a worse job than Truss and Kwarty did...!!!
I've got confidence in Rishi, Truss however was an absolute car crash - and you still think she was going in the right direction???
God help you if you really do.
Whitesince63 wrote:
Sluffy, on your high horse again. Just for once would you actually read a post before you make inaccurate comments deriding it? I agreed it was a car crash but the elements she proposed in her leadership campaign were agreed by virtually everyone and if she’d stuck to them, as Sunak is now doing, there wouldn’t have been any issue. She didn’t, she went far too far but even then, to sack Kwasi rather than just roll back on the proposals was wrong and she should have fallen on her sword.
That doesn’t though mean that the direction she was going in was wrong. Even on fracking she was right. Gas emits only 30% of the carbon emissions of coal and the widely accepted consensus is that moving towards gas generation and away from coal will be massively beneficial to climate change. Had we been able to produce the gas available it would have both secured our energy security as well as provided much needed well paid jobs plus a valuable export commodity. Yes, of course we need to have a genuine grown up discussion on the rights and wrongs and safety fears first but we’ve never had that, just the anti fracking brigade nutcases spouting nonsense.
This country is heading for the dogs unless a truly Conservative government takes the reins. Maybe it does need a dose of true Labour to let people see how really bad things can get but personally I’d rather not go there. If we keep on this path though we certainly will and for all Rishi’s steadying hand he won’t win an election I’m afraid.
Another almost 2000 arrived over the weekend so why is it a surprise that the place is becoming overcrowded? The numbers of these people coming is rising exponentially whilst the number of places to send them to is becoming more and more difficult as hotels themselves become full. Nobody wants to see the problem at Manston including Braverman I’m sure but what exactly do you expect her to do about it with nowhere to send them? Instead of just criticising all the time why don’t you suggest what to do with these people because Labour couldn’t in the commons yesterday,just like you, moan, moan, moan.wanderlust wrote:Looks like things are hotting up for Braverman after the official HM Prisons Inspectorate* report on Manston revealed that there are outbreaks of scabies and diptheria relating to the inhumane conditions and massive overcrowding inside.
Numbers have risen to over 4000 people - and as they are supposed to be processed within 24 hours, there are no beds, open toilets and no access to fresh air.
Some, including young children have been there for over a month.
* Prisons Inspectorate? Is it a prison or a refugee centre? Or a gulag?
Last edited by Ten Bobsworth on Tue Nov 01 2022, 10:21; edited 1 time in total
The Immigration system has been under Tory control for 12 years and they've broken it. Simply put, if they had invested the relatively minor costs of boosting the "clearing house" system so that immigrants could still be "processed" in 24 hours, the punitive costs of housing them would be slashed but they didn't.Whitesince63 wrote:
Another almost 2000 arrived over the weekend so why is it a surprise that the place is becoming overcrowded? The numbers of these people coming is rising exponentially whilst the number of places to send them to is becoming more and more difficult as hotels themselves become full. Nobody wants to see the problem at Manston including Braverman I’m sure but what exactly do you expect her to do about it with nowhere to send them? Instead of just criticising all the time why don’t you suggest what to do with these people because Labour couldn’t in the commons yesterday,just like you, moan, moan, moan.
Never heard Suella called that before.Ten Bobsworth wrote:Rishi's dog gets my vote.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11374649/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-Ive-never-known-political-class-touch-people.html
wanderlust wrote:
Never heard Suella called that before.
We are where we are now Lusty and the Manston situation is a recent event so what the Tory’s did over 12 years, however much I may agree with you, is irrelevant. I asked you where you would house the migrants increasingly coming in illegally. As usual you don’t answer, just drift off into another diatribe of how wicked the Tory’s are. Just tell me where you’d put them if not in Manston.wanderlust wrote:
The Immigration system has been under Tory control for 12 years and they've broken it. Simply put, if they had invested the relatively minor costs of boosting the "clearing house" system so that immigrants could still be "processed" in 24 hours, the punitive costs of housing them would be slashed but they didn't.
It's one thing to say they wish to control immigration but putting the people and systems in place to keep up with demand is another thing altogether. It is criminal that we have worker shortages and jobs for legitimate refugees - industry is desperate - and a government that hasn't put the system in place to separate them from economic migrants and criminals so that they can boost our economy and start paying taxes at the earliest possible time.
Furthermore recent events have proven beyond doubt that all the Tory bluster and threats about deportation to Africa etc has had absolutely ZERO effect on demand and wasting taxpayer's money on ineffective soundbite policies deprives the UK of the means to actually deal with it in a way that benefits UK PLC.
Everyone SHOULD be moaning so that we can get these incompetents out of power asap.
I wouldn't house illegal migrants at all White - you're barking up the wrong tree again.Whitesince63 wrote:
We are where we are now Lusty and the Manston situation is a recent event so what the Tory’s did over 12 years, however much I may agree with you, is irrelevant. I asked you where you would house the migrants increasingly coming in illegally. As usual you don’t answer, just drift off into another diatribe of how wicked the Tory’s are. Just tell me where you’d put them if not in Manston.
Yet more pie in the sky nonsense from you Lusty. Do you seriously believe that once they’ve landed they wouldn’t be protected by our insane legal brigade and woke groups to stop them being removed, even if they don’t have a legal right to be here? It’s happening now. Suggesting the use of prison ships or decommissioned liners is just ridiculous, it won’t happen and nor should it.wanderlust wrote:
I wouldn't house illegal migrants at all White - you're barking up the wrong tree again.
If the immigration system was functioning properly I'd do what the law says - they'd be checked out in 24 hours and if they're illegal i.e. don't qualify as bona fide refugees or meet other legal criteria for entry they have no right to be here.
Simple system for illegals. Park them on a "country of origin" ship offshore with zero benefits and basic food and medical care until there's enough to make the journey back financially viable for UK PLC. The UK has operated prison ships before and they're far cheaper than conventional prisons and hotels. I wouldn't necessarily be against the idea of setting up the ships as modern day workhouses so they could make a financial contribution towards their own deportment as that would send a very strong message to anyone thinking of taking the piss.
For legal immigrants they either have a job or family to come to or they're given a job i.e. no freeloaders. And no access to state medical services and benefits unless they've paid taxes.
Legal migrants we should welcome with open arms. Illegal migrants should get short shrift - but without a functioning filtering system we're f****d which is the point I made.
You can save your rhetoric for the idiots who live on a diet of propaganda and xenophobic cliches White because it's inaccurate and irrelevant.Whitesince63 wrote:
Yet more pie in the sky nonsense from you Lusty. Do you seriously believe that once they’ve landed they wouldn’t be protected by our insane legal brigade and woke groups to stop them being removed, even if they don’t have a legal right to be here? It’s happening now. Suggesting the use of prison ships or decommissioned liners is just ridiculous, it won’t happen and nor should it.
What you’re suggesting is common sense and logic, that if they don’t have a right to be here then they should be immediately removed but there are too many vested interests intent on preventing that. It’s a total mess but as long as these bleeding hearts continue to exasperate the situation it won’t be revolved. Under the rules, any Albanians arriving here should already be immediately sent back because they don’t meet any of the criteria for asylum. Let’s see if the Tory’s can achieve that but I have my doubts the invasion can be ceased.
wanderlust wrote: Moan, moan, bitch, moan.....and so on and so on, ceaselessly and unendingly.
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