So who was wrong about Jutkiewicz?

I wasn't wrong about him...I decided to give him a chance and saw his previous goal scoring form as something which potentially could return. He offers much more than goals though. As Biggie recently said, he's like Kevin Davies, but much better (or something along those lines)

BoltonTillIDie wrote:I wasn't wrong about him...I decided to give him a chance and saw his previous goal scoring form as something which potentially could return.  He offers much more than goals though.  As Biggie recently said, he's like Kevin Davies, but much better (or something along those lines)

BTID Don't get me wrong, from what I saw today he's like SKD was about seven or eight years ago. The Watford defence didn't have a clue what to do with him and he created gaps in their back line Stevie Wonder could drive a lorry through.   

However, I feel that four games is not enough to start crowing "he's fantastic" just as it wouldn't be enough to say "he's junk" if he hadn't scored any. What bothers me is simple. He and Mason performed very well and I'd love to see them do that for the rest of the season but then what? They're not ours, there's no guarantee they ever will be either. 

Dougie has GOT to start getting the best out of the players we DO own rather than ones who come in for a few weeks most likely aiming to put themselves in the window for new deals or new clubs elsewhere. 

He's failed so badly in that regard it's scary and I for one can't help wondering why he feels the need to keep sending OUR players on loan elsewhere when they could be doing the same job. Someone else mentioned on another thread that Cravies and Eaves have very similar styles to Joe and Juke and with Beckford close to fitness as well that could have been THREE possible strikers of our own. Cravies and Beckford in particular is a partnership I'd like to see.

His contract is not due to run out until 2017! So unless we buy him and Boro want to sell him it will be just a loan signing. I know its very early days but he's been great so far

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luckyPeterpiper wrote:

However, I feel that four games is not enough to start crowing "he's fantastic" just as it wouldn't be enough to say "he's junk" if he hadn't scored any.

I don't think anyone is saying that he's 'fantastic' after four games but there were plenty including you who were writing him off before you'd seen him play.

luckyPeterpiper wrote:I don't much rate Jutkiewicz based on two things. One his stats which I admit I got from sky sports news and two a quick scout of what Boro fans had to say about him.

luckyPeterpiper wrote:this is a bad move for a mediocre player.

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Copper Dragon wrote:

luckyPeterpiper wrote:

However, I feel that four games is not enough to start crowing "he's fantastic" just as it wouldn't be enough to say "he's junk" if he hadn't scored any.

I don't think anyone is saying that he's 'fantastic' after four games but there were plenty including you who were writing him off before you'd seen him play.

luckyPeterpiper wrote:I don't much rate Jutkiewicz based on two things. One his stats which I admit I got from sky sports news and two a quick scout of what Boro fans had to say about him.

luckyPeterpiper wrote:this is a bad move for a mediocre player.

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Yes Copper I said it and stand by it. Based on what information I was able to glean it made little sense to lend Cravies out to bring this guy in. It STILL makes little sense to me. As I said and still say we have more urgent needs in the form of a left back. 

Four games in the lad has done very well so far; I have not for one moment said otherwise but are you seriously saying four games is enough to start crowing everyone who didn't feel he'd be good is an idiot? 

Let's just take a closer look shall we? twenty four appearances for two goals against a striker with 5 goals from 20 apps. If this lad was in Dyche's sights what would you have said? 

I have no problem with saying I still have doubts about Jutkiewicz in the longer term. I hope I'm wrong for our sake but he seems to be a "confidence" player. When something goes right he bangs them in for fun but one bad day can drop his head faster than a Chelsea player's wife's head fell into John Terry's lap. 

His stats show short bursts of good form followed by long periods of drought. The Boro fans, including one whom I have known for better than thirty years and respect hugely all say the same thing. He's a luxury player, one who on his day sets the world on fire but the days are too few and far between to make him a mainstay of any team. Between those amazing days he is mediocre and often lets his head go down as I mentioned earlier. 

Tell me Copper, where and when did you say he'd be brilliant? Or even good? I've yet to see you provide a link to that.

Hipster_nebula wrote:as ever he's being slagged to F on twitter by Bolton fans.

really hope he can come in and score 6 or 7 so the same people can kiss his ass.

3 down, four to go.

What's it matter - we all make mistakes.

A large part of football is all about opinions - two people can sit next to each other, watch a game and have a totally opposite view what they have just seen.

It's pushing it a bit to tell people 'I told you so'. - we all aren't as clever as you, you know - but to start to rub their noses in it when they get wrong by digging out quotes is going a bit too far imo.

This is a forum that prides itself on having a bit of fun, where everything isn't necessarily weighed, sifted, analysed and cogitated thouroughly before being posted on here - much of it is actually posted from the heart rather than the head - and sometimes after a glass or two too many!

So more than a few gave their opinion of a player they knew little if anything about - nothing new about that - it happens at every club about probably every player who as ever kicked a ball!

We want a spontaneous forum, where people can express their opinions freely - irrespective if they later turn out to be right or wrong - otherwise what's the point in talking about anything - we might as well keep quite until the end of the season then analyse what happend then.  Wouldm't be much of a forum if we did that though would it?  Part of the fun of a forum is learning from others, having a laugh when things go wrong, pulling the odd leg or two.

Fair play to your knowledge of players in this division (and probably others too) but if others want to make their own judgments - and they turn out to be wrong - so what?  You were proved right and they weren't.

Enjoy your victory - you told us so - but be please be a tad more gracious about it next time.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:

Hipster_nebula wrote:as ever he's being slagged to F on twitter by Bolton fans.

really hope he can come in and score 6 or 7 so the same people can kiss his ass.

3 down, four to go.

Never slagged him Hipster, just felt he was a mediocre signing and an unnecessary one. I still do. Yes he's done well so far but I stand by my initial comments. It made no sense to send Cravies out to get "game time" under his belt then borrow someone else's player to do the same job. Why are we sending THREE strikers of our own out on loan. Sordell I get, he doesn't want to be here, fine, send him on his way and good riddance but Eaves and Cravies could have stayed and played the same roles as Mason and Juke today. What bothers me is this; as well as Juke is doing he isn;t our player. Dougie needs to get the best out of th players we already own rather than keep farming them out. 

I've had a damned good day today, thoroughly enjoyed the win, felt Mavies and Juke were MOM but I worry that we'll have a good run based on Juke and Mason's playing well then be back to square one in the summer when they go back to their parent clubs AT BEST.

At worst Juke will have a mare against Blackburn and his head will drop. See my last post to Copper concerning that. 

Seriously, we need a left back, we could and should have kept our own strikers here and focussed solely on solving that problem. 

Also, once Beckford is fit what happens then? He was on a pretty good run before he got injured. Do we now say "sorry you can't play because we prefer to keep two guys out there who don't belong to us?" 

I'm all for competition for places but we should have been using our own guys to provide it, not sending them out willy nilly and bringing in players who won't benefit BOLTON WANDERERS in the long term.

I never said you slagged him, but all our new signings have been abused on twitter. Even being boo'd before the start of the match apparently!

and it's not about "being clever" after the fact, the only thing i say is why not see the lads play a few games? Seems reasonable to me, this is the club we supposedly support. 

I've said loads of stupid shit on here thats been complete bollocks down the road and will continue too.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:I never said you slagged him, but all our new signings have been abused on twitter. Even being boo'd before the start of the match apparently!

and it's not about "being clever" after the fact, the only thing i say is why not see the lads play a few games? Seems reasonable to me, this is the club we supposedly support. 

I've said loads of stupid shit on here thats been complete bollocks down the road and will continue too.

Fair enough mate, been there done that on more than one occasion myself.   

But as to Jutkiewicz I'll say I'm pleasantly surprised up to now, very much so. He really does remind me of SKD in his early days. He had Watford's back line chasing him all afternoon and the grin he was wearing while they kept trying to clatter him reminded me of Kevin Nolan at times.   

I hope he keeps it up because if he can keep dragging defences out of position the way he did today Mason Mavies and Moritz should all have a field day in the gaps he creates.   

Proof of how old I am, I haven't seen a lad take a kick to the shins and grin like that in our shirt since Neil Whatmore when he was running rings around Division Two defences in the late seventies. 

After Sluffy's considered, moderate response to this garbage, I'm going to dumb it down a bit for the sake of equanimity.

Copper Dragon is a Burnley fan who purports to have a soft spot for Bolton. (Bollocks - there's no such thing. I've lived there and they hate us.)

This article is nothing more than a trite attempt at winding us up and causing an argument between us Bolton fans.

CD, enjoy your sojourn in the sun next season. Big Sean will probably get you about 35 points in the Prem and you'll be every armchair Chelsea fan's second team. 

Well done.

But leave the shit stirring to us.

We're more than capable of starting a row on our own.........

Breadman wrote:After Sluffy's considered, moderate response to this garbage, I'm going to dumb it down a bit for the sake of equanimity.

Copper Dragon is a Burnley fan who purports to have a soft spot for Bolton. (Bollocks - there's no such thing. I've lived there and they hate us.)

This article is nothing more than a trite attempt at winding us up and causing an argument between us Bolton fans.

CD, enjoy your sojourn in the sun next season. Big Sean will probably get you about 35 points in the Prem and you'll be every armchair Chelsea fan's second team. 

Well done.

But leave the shit stirring to us.

We're more than capable of starting a row on our own.........

Who? Us? Surely not breadman. This board is a haven of well reasoned, intelligent debate where all is sweetness and light.   

Are you sure you haven't confused us with some Claret Crazy site?  

Does Hipster agree.....?

Sluffy wrote:What's it matter - we all make mistakes.

A large part of football is all about opinions - two people can sit next to each other, watch a game and have a totally opposite view what they have just seen.

It's pushing it a bit to tell people 'I told you so'. - we all aren't as clever as you, you know - but to start to rub their noses in it when they get wrong by digging out quotes is going a bit too far imo.

This is a forum that prides itself on having a bit of fun, where everything isn't necessarily weighed, sifted, analysed and cogitated thouroughly before being posted on here - much of it is actually posted from the heart rather than the head - and sometimes after a glass or two too many!

So more than a few gave their opinion of a player they knew little if anything about - nothing new about that - it happens at every club about probably every player who as ever kicked a ball!

We want a spontaneous forum, where people can express their opinions freely - irrespective if they later turn out to be right or wrong - otherwise what's the point in talking about anything - we might as well keep quite until the end of the season then analyse what happend then.  Wouldm't be much of a forum if we did that though would it?  Part of the fun of a forum is learning from others, having a laugh when things go wrong, pulling the odd leg or two.

Fair play to your knowledge of players in this division (and probably others too) but if others want to make their own judgments - and they turn out to be wrong - so what?  You were proved right and they weren't.

Enjoy your victory - you told us so - but be please be a tad more gracious about it next time.

Bloody hell Sluffy, wind it in you soft sod.   

Just a few questions/points.....

1) How do you know that I'm not having a bit of fun with this? After all this forum 'prides itself on it'.

2) If you have quick off the mark gobshites who don't know what they are talking about, then you are always going to have someone telling them that they're wrong and proving that they're wrong.

3) I was asked to prove it, but I left it a while, then I decided to because of the wet blanket talkative one.


It seems to have got folk posting and talking anyroad.

Breadman wrote:

Copper Dragon is a Burnley fan who purports to have a soft spot for Bolton.

No, I never have Bread un.

Breadman wrote:Does Hipster agree.....?

Of course he does, he is after all the voice of reason, at least that's what he says?   

And we wouldn't dream of suggesting otherwise would we?    

Copper, if you didn't secretly want to be a Trotter, you wouldn't spend half your life on here, would you?

And you have previously indicated an affection for Bolton.

Don't back-track now.......

luckyPeterpiper wrote:

Tell me Copper, where and when did you say he'd be brilliant? Or even good? I've yet to see you provide a link to that.

I haven't said those things, so you won't see me put up a link.

I would suggest though that your Boro supporting friend is partially sighted.

Breadman wrote:Copper, if you didn't secretly want to be a Trotter, you wouldn't spend half your life on here, would you?

And you have previously indicated an affection for Bolton.

Don't back-track now.......

Yes 'half my life' and yes an 'affection'.

Prove either one.   

I'm going to hazard a guess that the 'wet blanket talkative one' is me. 

So be it, at least I have the good grace to try and put a logical reason to what I type. I do NOT come on here or any other board typing "I told you so" in an attempt to make myself look clever. I certainly wouldn't dream of entering a Burnley board and making a post that appears designed to be inflammatory and denigrates their fans for expressing an opinion about a player Dyche has signed at all much less when he's only played four games in your shirt. 

Copper, you are acting like a pratt, a particularly silly one at that. I rather suspect there's still an element of "COYLE IS JUDAS" in your stance after he left you to come to us.  

Personally I hope Burnley DO go up, my uncle David is a lifelong claret and it would make him happy. However I also hope that the Burnley board learn from their last premiership adventure and put a bit of money into strengthening your squad if they want to stay there or you'll come straight back down again. 

BWFC made a lot of mistakes with money by spending too much, I'd be the first to say so but to survive in the Premiership Burnley will need to invest and quite heavily if they want to stay there. The important thing will be to do it wisely.