Another black manager sacked

Breadman wrote:I don't know the actual stats but I would imagine that the number of black players in the English leagues is disproportionately high.

Stats don't matter, remember.

on the positive discrimination thing, I think this picture sums up my views (yes, I know there is no racial diversity, yes I know they aren't watching football, I didn't create it, but it represents my view)

Treating everyone equally doesn't always give equality of opportunity

what are the figures for ex professional black players actually taking their coaching badges? You can't be a manager these days without the relevant licences i thought?

Norpig wrote:it's nothing to do with colour it's the fact they aren't doing a good job

Nailed it.

Chairmanda wrote:on the positive discrimination thing, I think this picture sums up my views (yes, I know there is no racial diversity, yes I know they aren't watching football, I didn't create it, but it represents my view)

Treating everyone equally doesn't always give equality of opportunity

A very good analogy!

There is a dearth of Asian managers at all levels of football in the UK. Nobody seems to take umbrage about that.

That's the point though, this isn't about representing society as a whole, but the transition from player to manager. As there are next to no Asian footballers (Neil Taylor's half Indian, Michael Chopra too?) in the UK that point really doesn't work, whereas there are a huge amount of black players yet only 4 black mangers.

Manda's analogy is excellent, we need to create a situation where everyone has the same level of opportunity, so if introducing the Rooney rule provides a platform to do that then so be it.

but surely the rooney rule is going to push black ex players into jobs just for the sake of it when they may not be ready or qualified for or even any good at it?

I blame CD.

Norpig wrote:but surely the rooney rule is going to push black ex players into jobs just for the sake of it when they may not be ready or qualified for or even any good at it?

Don't think so mate, all it means is they get the opportunity to get interviewed there's no obligation for them to be employed but it at least gets them through the door in the first place.

So the board and/or chairman of a football club only becomes picky about colour when they are looking for a manager?

They are happy to employ a third or half a team of black players though?

Don't know, appears that way statistically doesn't it. Employing somebody as a managerial massivley different to a player.

What do we lose from doing the Rooney rule?

bwfc1874 wrote:What do we lose from doing the Rooney rule?

In the US most, in fact probably 99%, of black players are born and bred US citizens.

Many of the black players in Britain (as in now) are foreign nationals, and they don't usually settle here after their football playing career has finished.

I really don't think that it's fair to argue about how many black players there are playing and relate it to how few black managers there are.

That being said,I can see England putting out an all black team within 20 years,if not sooner.

I think your estimates of how many black British players there are in the leagues is some way off reality.

That was in reply to Copper not you Bonce.

bwfc1874 wrote:I think your estimates of how many black British players there are in the leagues is some way off reality. 

I haven't estimated how many black British players there are but if you took out the black foreign national players then the figure would be less obviously.

The Rooney rule and your argument is based on the ratio of black players to black managers and the ratio isn't that extreme.

Ye it would be less, but it still wouldn't be as low as 4 out of 92. Incidentally one of those 4 is Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink. I don't understand your issue with it to be honest, nobody's saying minorities automatically get the job they just get a platform to try and even out the amount of opportunities they receive. What's bad about that?

You are using figures as an argument for ex black footballers not receiving the same amount of opportunities, when you have no idea of what the process is of any football club trying to find a new manager. How do you know that they aren't being considered for a job?

A Rooney rule in this country would be an absolute joke, it would go totally against the fair play that this country prides itself on.

If you're good enough you will be selected, regardless of colour.

You're making the opposite assumption, the only difference is there is some evidence to back mine up ie far less black managers compared to black players indicates the opportunities aren't there. The Rooney rule wouldn't gift anybody a job it would just give them a platform they may not have had, providing the kind of equality this country prides itself on.