HomeIn all seriousness I've heard people praising her 'remarkable resilience' - essentially for not resigning despite getting battered for 2 years.
Embarrassingly low standards.
Embarrassingly low standards.
Brexit negotiations
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gloswhite
Dunkels King
wanderlust
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Natasha Whittam
Angry Dad
Hipster_Nebula
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okocha
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21 posters
Message [Page 12 of 50]
222 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 12:31
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
You might be right, but she's done what she set out to do despite many saying she wouldn't keep her job.
223 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 13:34
Guest
Guest
She set out to get us a good deal, she's ended up capitulating to the EU and giving in to near enough every one of their demands.
I don't blame her for that, it was obvious we'd never get a good deal out of them to everyone except leavers - especially if we want to end freedom of movement.
But let's not pretend she's negotiated with any skill or expertise, or that she's led the country well. It's been a shambles for two years, and now she's got to get it through parliament.
I don't blame her for that, it was obvious we'd never get a good deal out of them to everyone except leavers - especially if we want to end freedom of movement.
But let's not pretend she's negotiated with any skill or expertise, or that she's led the country well. It's been a shambles for two years, and now she's got to get it through parliament.
224 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 13:43
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
I agree it's a shambles, but she's done her best with little support.
225 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 13:47
Guest
Guest
She's responsible for the state of these negotiations over the last two years, she triggered Article 50 without laying any groundwork, she called a general election and she set her red lines - which pandered to the right of her party and made a rod for her own back in negotiations.
If this is 'her best' it's a long way short of the standards we need.
If this is 'her best' it's a long way short of the standards we need.
226 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 13:48
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
T.R.O.Y wrote:She's responsible for the state of these negotiations over the last two years, she triggered Article 50 without laying any groundwork, she called a general election and she set her red lines - which pandered to the right of her party and made a rod for her own back in negotiations.
If this is 'her best' it's a long way short of the standards we need.
When did any politician (in recent times) meet the required standard?
227 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 13:58
Guest
Guest
So your solution to that is to lower your standards and congratulate her for doing a great job at not resigning?
I'd prefer them to be held to account.
I'd prefer them to be held to account.
228 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 14:50
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
T.R.O.Y wrote:She's responsible for the state of these negotiations over the last two years, she triggered Article 50 without laying any groundwork, she called a general election and she set her red lines - which pandered to the right of her party and made a rod for her own back in negotiations.
If this is 'her best' it's a long way short of the standards we need.
Pandering to the right wing europhobes in the Tory party is her biggest mistake. There was no public demand or even interest in a referendum in the first place. We only had one because Cameron foolishly thought he would win it and that would shut up the right wing element. It wouldn't have worked even if he had won.
If May had not immediately committed herself to a hard brexit she would have had more room for manoeuvre. However for purely party political reasons and in a futile attempt to buy the support of the right wing loons in her party she set her red lines. This is neither good leadership nor the basis for effective negotiation.
229 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:13
Guest
Guest
Bob on XM, she made a rod for her own back by going for popularity with her party over what was good for the country. Laughable that anyone can look at her performance and say anything positive.
230 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:18
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
T.R.O.Y wrote:So your solution to that is to lower your standards and congratulate her for doing a great job at not resigning?
I'd prefer them to be held to account.
It's easy to say you'd hold them to account when you sit in the Labour camp.
She's done a good job in difficult circumstances, that's all I'm saying.
231 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:19
Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
T.R.O.Y wrote:Laughable that anyone can look at her performance and say anything positive.
You always let yourself down with the insults. I have a differing view, just accept it.
232 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:26
Guest
Guest
Natasha Whittam wrote:T.R.O.Y wrote:Laughable that anyone can look at her performance and say anything positive.
You always let yourself down with the insults. I have a differing view, just accept it.
Didn’t meant to insult, surprised maybe a better word for it.
233 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:35
Guest
Guest
Natasha Whittam wrote:T.R.O.Y wrote:So your solution to that is to lower your standards and congratulate her for doing a great job at not resigning?
I'd prefer them to be held to account.
It's easy to say you'd hold them to account when you sit in the Labour camp.
She's done a good job in difficult circumstances, that's all I'm saying.
Fair enough, I just don’t understand what measure could be used to say she’s done a good job.
234 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 15:49
Sluffy
Admin
T.R.O.Y wrote:Bob on XM, she made a rod for her own back by going for popularity with her party over what was good for the country. Laughable that anyone can look at her performance and say anything positive.
Putting Brexit to one side, politics is all about gaining power, and once gained retaining it.
May (or anyone else) in her position as leader of the party in government would seek to retain their leadership (particularly faced with having no overall majority in Parliament) by having to please as many MP's as she can irrespective of their diverging views on the key issue of the time (Brexit obviously) in order not to lose crucial votes and ultimately her position as Prime Minister.
Therefore judged as purely a 'politician' she's done fantastically well to still remain in charge - despite a deeply divisive policy she has formulated and guided through Parliament (and the EU don't forget) and still be in with a shout of winning the key Commons vote coming up, despite probably the vast majority of her party, the rest of Parliament and probably the country as a whole - being against it!
However that being said, I think it probably speaks volumes as to how poorly democracy sometimes works when self interest of individuals and party's takes precedence over what most probably want - particularly when the main government opposition party itself puts its own agenda (obtaining power in the next General Election on the back of an publicly viewed unpopular delivered Brexit by the Conservative Party) before what I suspect most of it's members (and the public in general) would want.
However we are where we are and I dare say there are plenty of twists and turns yet to come in regards to Brexit yet.
235 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 16:38
Cajunboy
Frank Worthington
Following the election, the opposition Labour Party withdrew its opposition to holding an in-out EU referendum. On the bill's second reading, on 9 June 2015, MPs voted by 544 to 53 in favour of the principle of holding a referendum with only the Scottish National Party opposing the Bill.xmiles wrote:
Pandering to the right wing europhobes in the Tory party is her biggest mistake. There was no public demand or even interest in a referendum in the first place. We only had one because Cameron foolishly thought he would win it and that would shut up the right wing element. It wouldn't have worked even if he had won.
237 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 17:32
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
Cajunboy wrote:Following the election, the opposition Labour Party withdrew its opposition to holding an in-out EU referendum. On the bill's second reading, on 9 June 2015, MPs voted by 544 to 53 in favour of the principle of holding a referendum with only the Scottish National Party opposing the Bill.xmiles wrote:
Pandering to the right wing europhobes in the Tory party is her biggest mistake. There was no public demand or even interest in a referendum in the first place. We only had one because Cameron foolishly thought he would win it and that would shut up the right wing element. It wouldn't have worked even if he had won.
The Labour party campaigned against a referendum during the 2015 general election, quite correctly pointing out that it would be destabilising. Just because they then failed to oppose Cameron's proposal in no way undermines the basic point: it was Cameron's stupid idea to hold a referendum and he only did it for selfish party political reasons.
238 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 18:08
Cajunboy
Frank Worthington
So it was okay for The Labour party to destabilise the country after the election?
I see, thanks.
I see, thanks.
239 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 18:35
Guest
Guest
Cajunboy wrote:So it was okay for The Labour party to destabilise the country after the election?
I see, thanks.
What? That doesn’t make any sense. They campaigned against the referendum and then gave up on losing the election.
240 Re: Brexit negotiations Sun Nov 25 2018, 19:02
xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
Cajunboy wrote:So it was okay for The Labour party to destabilise the country after the election?
I see, thanks.
Are you serious?
Cameron had a majority and he was going to have the referendum whatever the Labour party did or did not do. It was Cameron who destabilised the country for purely selfish party political reasons.
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