Brexit negotiations

T.R.O.Y wrote:I doubt even the most ardent Brexit supporter would still claim leaving is going to be beneficial to our economy.

Brexit is an ideological position, that’s clear now.

It always  has been, that's why remainers don't get it.

Cajunboy wrote:

T.R.O.Y wrote:I doubt even the most ardent Brexit supporter would still claim leaving is going to be beneficial to our economy.

Brexit is an ideological position, that’s clear now.

It always  has been, that's why remainers don't get it.

Don’t disagree that for many it always has been. But that wasn’t the case during the referendum, leading Brexiteers constantly told us we’d flourish - clearly that won’t be the case.

I think that’s led to a lot of the ill feeling, as has the ideological standpoint, I don’t think we’re going to have any more ‘freedom’ once we come out, the control the EU had over us and our laws was greatly exaggerated.

So a lot of remainers - myself included are left wondering what we will gain.

We had a great opportunity. It really isn't the voters fault that this government has failed to grasp it.

Both sides need to turn their anger on politicians rather than each other.

What is the opportunity?

It was really down to the government. We heard a lot about our new found ability to strike deals around the world, they chose not to make any.

Without any alternative to the EU free trade deal they weakened their own hand.

Very true, think that lack of action has fed Remainers bitterness too. Whether it’s down to not working hard enough to get them or is not being as attractive a proposition as we thought is up for debate.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:It was really down to the government. We heard a lot about our new found ability to strike deals around the world, they chose not to make any.

Without any alternative to the EU free trade deal they weakened their own hand.

But there was never going to be alternative trade deals - that was just another lie - at best wishful thinking - used as a tactic to seduce nationalist voters. One of many. We had trade deals with just about every nation on the planet though...but leaving the EU is about cancelling them not the other way round.

So you can hardly blame the Government for not getting trade deals that were never a possibility in the first place. 

What you can blame them for is persisting with the myth and trying to railroad it through for their own political ends even after it was long apparent that the whole Leave manifesto - including the La La Land trade deal nonsense was a steaming pile of bullshit.

Talking of trade deals, one of the biggest free trade deals of all time comes into force this week. For the first time, there will be tarriff free arrangement between Japan and the EU that will affect an estimated one-third of the entire world's GDP.

Europe will get cheaper electronic goods, machinery and parts which will lead to cars manufactured in Europe becoming cheaper amongst other things.

Japan will get food, clothing and other European - manufactured goods cheaper.

And having opted out, the UK will see unprecedented competition in the automotive industry putting pressure on the big foreign employers like Nissan to relocate to mainland Europe, with around 850,000 jobs, 12% of our total exports, and 3.65 BILLION PER ANNUM of foreign investment in the UK put at risk. On top of that, other industries including food exports will be less competitive than those of our European neighbours.

Why do Japan get a free trade deal without being members of the SM and CU I thought that wasn't allowed.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:Why do Japan get a free trade deal without being members of the SM and CU I thought that wasn't allowed.

All I know is that the EU uses it's massive collective bargaining powers to swing deals that the little old UK has no chance of getting. 
Just another little step along the road to the one world vision that the human race will have to achieve if we are to survive as a species in the long run.

But I thought they were rules based.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

With little time left before D Day Tesco axe 9000 and cut hours for others.

Make sense really as there will be no food to sell.

Where's the bit about SM and CU membership.

A good day for May today, and a well deserved kicking for Cooper and Grieve. 

How is this a good day? She’s being sent back to negotiate on something she can’t get a change on. A complete waste of time.

gloswhite wrote:A good day for May today, and a well deserved kicking for Cooper and Grieve. 

An even better day for Robert Mercer and the other foreigners who will profit massively from a no-deal Brexit which looks even more likely now - although with Parliament having made it clear that no deal was unacceptable, May's deal will be the only option.
An absolute disaster for Britain though.

Within minutes of the vote, the French, Irish and Tusk reiterated that the deal was not open to renegotiation so when May comes back with "sorry but I tried and they weren't having it" (possibly spun as a victory) there will be no time and no other option but to accept the deal that nobody wants.
The CBI have reacted immediately with this statement.

Difficult to see how economic and social decline is avoidable now. There is no "backstop" for British firms and it is to the eternal shame of the Tories that they have railroaded us down a path that will destroy this once great nation - although the full impact won't be felt for a few years yet as under May's deal we will remain under EU law until circa 2020 but without any of the benefits of membership.

What gets me is how strategically naive our Government is.

Surely they must have realised that in backing an amendment that instructs May to do the impossible they effectively removed any possibility of finding an alternative to the deal they wholeheartedly rejected?

A very accurate summary, Wanderlust.

She's spent the last few months saying there is no alternative to the deal she's offering. The EU is saying her red lines will not get any alternative to the deal.

Yet yesterday she stands at the box trying to push an amendment through that means she needs to go and do what she'd said herself was impossible.

Utterly delusional woman, how can anyone take her seriously.