Coronavirus - will we survive?

Sluffy wrote:

The problem is society's behaviour causing the issue and not how effective (or not) the government of the day is in dealing with the effects of that cause.



Boris/the government isn't the issue - society's non compliance with the basic rules to avoid most/all of this is.

You keep ignoring the reality that the government does has a responsibility and a more effective government would have handled many aspects of the crisis better. Simply writing essays where you just repeat yourself endlessly is not actually rebutting this point.

xmiles wrote:

Sluffy wrote:

The problem is society's behaviour causing the issue and not how effective (or not) the government of the day is in dealing with the effects of that cause.



Boris/the government isn't the issue - society's non compliance with the basic rules to avoid most/all of this is.

You keep ignoring the reality that the government does has a responsibility and a more effective government would have handled many aspects of the crisis better. Simply writing essays where you just repeat yourself endlessly is not actually rebutting this point.

Ok then how should the government enforce the mass public noncompliance with social distancing, not undertaking self isolation, taking virus tests when having no symptoms, enforcing the wearing of masks in shops, ensuring pubs are taking correct names and addresses and enforcing social distancing within their premises, stop illegal raves, prevent mass visits to tourist spots unequipped to cater for such numbers, provide professionally trained staff at the drop of a hat and a million and one other things people are doing what they shouldn't be doing because I don't know, clearly the government doesn't know, and the police aren't able to prevent because of the totally overwhelming numbers of 'breeches of the rules' involved somewhere every minute of the day - but I guess you do?

Or is it just going to be just more anti-government rhetoric you churn out from this account once again?

Sluffy wrote:

Ok then how should the government enforce the mass public noncompliance with social distancing, not undertaking self isolation, taking virus tests when having no symptoms, enforcing the wearing of masks in shops, ensuring pubs are taking correct names and addresses and enforcing social distancing within their premises, stop illegal raves, prevent mass visits to tourist spots unequipped to cater for such numbers, provide professionally trained staff at the drop of a hat and a million and one other things people are doing what they shouldn't be doing because I don't know, clearly the government doesn't know, and the police aren't able to prevent because of the totally overwhelming numbers of 'breeches of the rules' involved somewhere every minute of the day - but I guess you do?

Or is it just going to be just more anti-government rhetoric you churn out from this account once again?

You omitted "because you obviously think you know better than everyone else"



I'm jealous 




..and Nat answered the question in another thread.

I am not denying that non-compliance with government guidelines has caused serious problems and that it is impossible for any democratic government to enforce these measures. And I am sure you and agree that the behaviour of the anti-vaxxers is totally reprehensible.

However this government could have done better in so many ways. Instead it appoints the people like Dido Harding and distracts with meaningless bullshit like Boris' moonshot.

Finally how many times do I have to tell you that I only have, and only ever have had, one account. You have never provided a shred of evidence to demonstrate otherwise.

wanderlust wrote:

Sluffy wrote:

Ok then how should the government enforce the mass public noncompliance with social distancing, not undertaking self isolation, taking virus tests when having no symptoms, enforcing the wearing of masks in shops, ensuring pubs are taking correct names and addresses and enforcing social distancing within their premises, stop illegal raves, prevent mass visits to tourist spots unequipped to cater for such numbers, provide professionally trained staff at the drop of a hat and a million and one other things people are doing what they shouldn't be doing because I don't know, clearly the government doesn't know, and the police aren't able to prevent because of the totally overwhelming numbers of 'breeches of the rules' involved somewhere every minute of the day - but I guess you do?

Or is it just going to be just more anti-government rhetoric you churn out from this account once again?

You omitted "because you obviously think you know better than everyone else"


I'm jealous 

..and Nat answered the question in another thread.

Are you referring to hard-line policing - if so refer to what I've already said above - the police can't cope with enforcing what is going on and do you/we really want to move towards a China like system which can and does?

I don't think so.

The xmiles account may well be a fake one but at least they are not someone who can't accept ever being wrong and feels the need to act superior to an audience of anonymous strangers to prove and justify themself presumably to your very own self!

xmiles wrote:I am not denying that non-compliance with government guidelines has caused serious problems and that it is impossible for any democratic government to enforce these measures. And I am sure you and agree that the behaviour of the anti-vaxxers is totally reprehensible.

However this government could have done better in so many ways. Instead it appoints the people like Dido Harding and distracts with meaningless bullshit like Boris' moonshot.

Finally how many times do I have to tell you that I only have, and only ever have had, one account. You have never provided a shred of evidence to demonstrate otherwise.

Just as I expected -

Sluffy wrote:Or is it just going to be just more anti-government rhetoric you churn out from this account once again?

As for the fake account we've done that.

You either live with it or you move on some place else.

Your choice.

Natasha Whittam wrote:


Okocha, you're like a broken record, do us all a favour and shut up.

How rude....and after I'd just praised you for changing your tune and criticising Boris!  
 
I'll keep quiet when Johnson, Cummings and the sycophants stop doing damage to the UK.....which should be the major concern of all of us.

Meanwhile, do try to be civil, even if you disagree.

Sluffy wrote:

I stopped reading at that statement of complete bollocks.

Sluffy, you're entitled to disagree, but, just as I said to Nat, I'd ask you to please at least be civil.

Sluffy wrote:

So do you agree that the government could have done better?

xmiles wrote:So do you agree that the government could have done better?

No idea what you were trying to quote but I've already said this previously -

Sluffy wrote:Nah, your missing my point entirely.

I'm not saying anywhere that I'm happy with the governments performance - quite clearly it is poor and I don't think many could argue otherwise.

My point is simply that the governments - virtually all across the world I guess - have told people the clear and unambiguous steps to take to stop the virus in its tracks.

Maybe some country's are too poor for all to comply with the rules but frankly there is no excuse in ours not to do so - yet masses of people simply ignore them every day.

Unless you want a government like China who 're-educates' everyone not toeing the line then you can hardly blame Boris et al for people not giving two fucks for anyone other than themselves.  Even good polices and strong governance don't stop people breaking the rules simply because they can't be arsed to follow them.

The problem is a social one - we KNOW how to stop the spread by simply following the rules - the problem is that too many people just don't follow them.

Just because they could do better - all governments could - doesn't mean they don't need the consent of the people to achieve things - and with the way people are ignoring the basics of social distancing etc, clearly the major problem is outside of anything the government is able to do, short of imposing a China style police state.

And no one wants that.

So I ask again what's your answer to the large list of questions I posted to you above because nobody I know has one and that includes the government and the police.

Yes so both society and government need to work effectively to beat this.

Or what I was telling you this morning, what are you even arguing for here?

T.R.O.Y. wrote:Yes so both society and government need to work effectively to beat this.

Or what I was telling you this morning, what are you even arguing for here?

Well if you want to go around in circles again...

In post 441 I replied to what you had said and refuted it by saying the basic rules are very, very clear and easily understood - social distance, wash hands, stay in bubble, etc, that the Government had delivered the answer and the means to do this and the fault is completely down to people. large numbers of them, simply not complying.

How then can that be the governments fault?

You clearly want it to be but apart from turning the state into a replica of China and arresting all dissenters and 're-educating' them, I don't know what else they could have done?

We are in a position now where they are once again having to play catch up for something they were not prepared for because they never factored in the publics  laissez faire/self entitlement/couldn't give a fuck attitude.

We are where we are now not because of the governments mismanagement but because of a goodly proportion of our society's gross selfishness and lack of any kind of thought or consideration for others.

How can that be Johnson/Dido/Cummings fault???

For the third time as I said at post 452:

You can't absolve this government of any responsibility for the mess we are in. They appointed Dido Harding as head of the test and trace programme. On Thursday she told MPs " I don't think anybody was expecting to see the really sizeable increase" in the demand for testing.

This is simply not true. Many experts knew there would be a significant increase following the return of children to school. Either she is stupidly incompetent or lying. Your choice.

Do you actually read what other people post?

xmiles wrote:For the third time as I said at post 452:

You can't absolve this government of any responsibility for the mess we are in. They appointed Dido Harding as head of the test and trace programme. On Thursday she told MPs " I don't think anybody was expecting to see the really sizeable increase" in the demand for testing.

This is simply not true. Many experts knew there would be a significant increase following the return of children to school. Either she is stupidly incompetent or lying. Your choice.

Do you actually read what other people post?

I don't usually bother with fake accounts.

But in answer to you, if I planned for say 80% of the population adhering to the rules and 20% not, then I would plan and prepare for an appropriate test and trace capacity requirement for when the schools go back.

If however the reality is that only 20% of the population adhered to the rules and 80% didn't then not only would I have insufficient capacity for when the schools went back I would also have had a huge unexpected and unplanned demand for testing leading up to the schools going back - and that in a nutshell is what happened.

Why is that then the governments fault???

Should they plan for 100% non adherence for planning everything from now on because clearly plenty still aren't bothering about doing the basic stuff like even social distancing!!!

Clearly they should!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54220065

You are the only person on this site who thinks this is a fake account. Why don't you post some evidence to back up your paranoid delusion?

I think we all know the answer to that. There isn't any evidence. You are just afraid to admit you are wrong.

xmiles wrote:You are the only person on this site who thinks this is a fake account. Why don't you post some evidence to back up your paranoid delusion?

I think we all know the answer to that. There isn't any evidence. You are just afraid to admit you are wrong.

People can think whatever they like.

You're a fake account and if you don't like me calling you out over it than go find some other place to play.

It really is that easy.

Sluffy wrote:

I don't usually bother with fake accounts.

But in answer to you, if I planned for say 80% of the population adhering to the rules and 20% not, then I would plan and prepare for an appropriate test and trace capacity requirement for when the schools go back.

If however the reality is that only 20% of the population adhered to the rules and 80% didn't then not only would I have insufficient capacity for when the schools went back I would also have had a huge unexpected and unplanned demand for testing leading up to the schools going back - and that in a nutshell is what happened.

Why is that then the governments fault???

Should they plan for 100% non adherence for planning everything from now on because clearly plenty still aren't bothering about doing the basic stuff like even social distancing!!!

Clearly they should!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54220065

Truly bizarre, you really haven’t got a grasp on this one at all.

And you need to stop the trolling of xmiles, clearly he’s not a fake account it’s just desperate to carry on with that line.

Waste of time. The guy's a wanker who will argue with anyone over nothing just to boost his own fragile ego.
We all know it so let's just leave it at that.

Don't get this i googled  fake accounts and it says someone who copies another's account same picture and pretends to be that account and posts to get the real poster in trouble? so where if this is so is the real Xmiles complaining about it. How is xmiles a fake account? Does sluffy think it's Breadman or someone else.

Anyone had a call from 03000135000? Its the COVID test and trace number.

I had three on Friday and I suspect they may have been bogus.

The first clue was that the calls came up on my landline as international calls.

Second clue was that the person I spoke to (third call) would tell me nothing about when the alleged contact with someone who tested positive for COVID had taken place.

Third clue was that I had been nowhere in the previous seven days where a test and trace form had been required or completed

Fourth clue was when I asked if he could ring me an hour later. We were just about to sit down for dinner and he had said the call would take 20 minutes. He suggested we speak at 10.30 on Saturday morning instead. 

Fifth clue is that no call has been received since.

Sixth clue is that the NHS has my mobile number and no text message has been received.

If it was bogus the guy on the phone would have been well capable of fooling a lot of folk.